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Petition Against February


Burns

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[quote name='zeTsu grass' timestamp='1282926436' post='67174']
as for the others' comments.. they all say he's "not an mp3" mp3.. and they keep airing senseless ideas..
...
he has attained great knowledge at mp3.. so what?
[/quote]
feb is not just another MP3, he is an alt of an MP5
No, everybody has to know by now that using your skills and playing by the rules means also that you can attack everybody everywhere in MD. But by interfering with someone's freedom of choice it is against the rules.

By remaining in MP3 just to be the nightmare of the noobs and by capping them on purpose and with no reason he is doing something wrong.

Someone mentioned a limit of 20 ppl to be capped. Why 20 ? if he did it to 2 ppl it should be enough.

I will not argue if he did it or not, but if he did it, he must pay for it and there is only 1 punishment for it: sent to MP5 (no story whatsoever) and no more alliance for him.

[quote]
you can organize a massive hunt and punish him within the limits of current game mechanics even. You can try to warn noobs against his kind.
[/quote]
Please Kafuuka, do to try and hunt him. Please, tell me what can you do using mechanics ?

[quote]
It seems to me that defeating an mp5 as an mp3 is cool. However, nothing makes as big an impact on the game as having the mechanics changes for/because of you. If that happens, I'll gladly nominate februari for biggest villain and most influential on the next festival.
[/quote]
Changing the game should not be required as the punishments can be done even now.
And ... Kafuuka, there are a lot of ppl that influenced the changes in this game. If you don't know this it doesn't mean that it didn't happen or maybe you just want to ignore the possibility.



-----
On more personal lvl, I don't like the dude because he is full of <insert bad word here>. He always kills he's creatures, so there is no fair game.
Since he started his topic, i tried to attack feb every time I found him but I was unable as he has no creatures alive.

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I've already spoken to Jester about this this morning. I strongly suggest that anyone that is in a situation like this at MP3 or MP4 should not be allowed to join alliances and should be removed from any they are in. If he can only attack MP3s then his reasons for staying MP3 become null and void. You don't need to change the mechanics, just change the situation. I would urge any leader, land, alliance or guild to consider the implications of situations such as this and put the general MD community first.

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Ok I have thought long and hard and even managed to read all the posts so now even with my own post I have been looking at what would be I hope to make point in this manner

First in regards what feb has done
His actions although questionable has not broken any rules yes you could argue he did this and that but he has not broken rules

With that in mind his actions has spurred many to dislike him and what he has done and yes me included.

But with taking all that into account and with time to think on the matter I don't think a harsh punishment is called for.

As you all know his actions has cause a long awated change to happen and that was to fix the free be farming this is one punishment all be it not a big one

If all alliances agree and remove feb from the alliance and not let him back in to one until he moves up to mp4 can be a punishment that the community as a whole can inflict. I think it better to use in game system to punish as that is the community taking action and not Mir having to spend time working out a solution that the community can action themselves

Yes some changes will come from febs actions that is normal when a player takes something a bit to far it forces a change to come sooner this has always been the case

With regard what feb has done to new mp3 players well I am afraid you will need to bring proff of his wrong doing and bring him to court to have him jailed or a worse punishment. Here is a thought if you can prove the damage he has done you could argue a punishment of your own like a reduction on his ve but don't try to dictate the amount as the would be murs desission to make

So instead of complaining why don't you take action on this and work together on the matter and get something done

Personaly I don't agree with the forcing to mp5 even if it is an alt use game mechanics to deal with a game mechanics issue. Other than the usual fixing that will happen when such a matter is brought up

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  • 2 weeks later...

Personally to me, complains against Feb seems to be more or less a clash between a few rules:

[list]
[*]Any repeated complain from multiple unique users will get some kind of unwanted action on you, try not to offend people, or to cause a mess in general
[/list]
and
[list]
[*]You can use rituals that other consider unfair, all rituals are allowed, except if abusing a bug, then you will have to report it first.
[/list]

However, there doesn't seem to be a fine or fair line drawn between either of them, the sky is the limit for all we know.

[list]
[*]By harrasment we [u][b]understand[/b][/u] constant verbal abuse and moking. Repeated attacks or other ways are not considered punishable harrasment but can be brought up for judging if you think they should.
[/list]


But in relation to the commotion Feb has caused, I think ruining another person's experience, attempting to force others to evolve is considered a form of harassment.
This again is listed on the rules but is extremely broad making it open to many interpretation.

I would agree with Burns in the sense that the ritual does seem unfair and his activeness is quite disturbing HOWEVER I personally am unsure (and unconvinced) that he was specifically targeting new players, in this sense; I will take it as the best in his case; and that he wasn't purposely targeting players to cap them.

And if so, I don't think he should be forced up an Mind Power just yet, I think we should give him a chance to correct or change his ritual and imposing a light sanction before moving him up, in essence MP3 still represents that he is learning about the game, sure he may have power but he lacks what older MPs have; that is of knowledge. (which in some form ties in with the community and hence the reason for the petition)

However, if he was purposely targeting new players to do nothing more than to force them to raise their Mind Power then I think he should be punished immediately because it is (or at least I see it as) a form of harassment.



Just my 2 - 3 cents on this issue.

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[quote name='Deatznce0' timestamp='1284911429' post='68683']
And if so, I don't think he should be forced up an Mind Power just yet, I think we should give him a chance to correct or change his ritual and imposing a light sanction before moving him up, in essence MP3 still represents that he is learning about the game, sure he may have power but he lacks what older MPs have; that is of knowledge. [/quote]

Please understand, I was fighting february back when I was an mp3 200 days ago. I am pushing MP6 now, and have lost to him as MP5. This is a player who knows what he is doing, and apparently is proud of it.

The issue is why certain players want to stay in tutorial mode (MP3), and what that does to the real beginners.

Beginners are a dwindling resource for MagicDuel and the game is threatened with collapse unless we draw in more players, instead of driving them away.

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[quote name='Fyrd Argentus' timestamp='1284930365' post='68703']
Please understand, I was fighting february back when I was an mp3 200 days ago. I am pushing MP6 now, and have lost to him as MP5. This is a player who knows what he is doing, and apparently is proud of it.

The issue is why certain players want to stay in tutorial mode (MP3), and what that does to the real beginners.

Beginners are a dwindling resource for MagicDuel and the game is threatened with collapse unless we draw in more players, instead of driving them away.
[/quote]

Actually I'm more or less aware of his age, I was fighting him back over 500 days ago (For most of you that don't know me, and that would be ALOT of you, I'm over 3 years old), but I still remain unconvinced that he's purposely driving away beginners.

I'm not defending him or his kind but it doesn't seem like he has broken a rule (or if he has, like a said, it's in between the unknown borderline of two of them: what he can/can't do), sure beginners are a dwindling resource but I don't think he should be punished (or as harshly) if he did not purposely set the ritual up to cap players.




[quote name='Muratus del Mur' timestamp='1283416032' post='67543']
Suggestion 1: If fight ends in a cap for one of the players, the other will get minus 10% ve as penalty.
cons:
- suicidal attacks to lower ve of a player by capping alts on him. Its fine, he should move on.
- hard to determine if fight will be such a fight or not, but it does happen only once, right? maybe this will keep vets more careful when atacking random noobs?
- overall paranoia
pros:
- noobs attacking and capping an older account will not feel much of a 10% penalty because their vitality total is anyway low. But vets will suffer from 10%



Suggestion 2: No Ve reward for saking creatures at mp lower than 4
cons:
- limiting developing of character at mp3
- limits just one type of mp3 overpower
pros:
- adds something more to the mp4+ levels



Suggestion 3:
- Add a count of how many players someone capped. On a certain number penalize him somehow but not move him.
pros: limits repetitive abuse
cons: persistent players that want to do that will still do it
penalty suggestion: apply one random action of these. the difference in severity is a risk to consider: destroy one random creature regardless of level rarity or age. Destroy one random item not marked rare(admin items). Lower ve by 30%. Lower all stats by 15%. Jail time one week.



What and why not:
- no forcing someone to next mp, its true some want to stay at mp3 as a role and holding the ability to move them is dengerous
- no stats cap. I don't think any of you, or me, can decide what decent stats are or where to place this cap
- no sak limit, can get annoying when you realised you got only aramors and want to sac them but you cant. Sac for free is also not good because it alters the concept of sacrificing and for a noob to see that is not good and makes no sense.
[/quote]

Suggestion 1: The cons seem to outweigh the pros in this case... However, I like this proposal!

Suggestion 2: With the removal of the the massive VE boost from lvl2 Angiens it seems like this has already been put into effect, I again have no complaints.

Suggestion 3: I'm unsure as to how this would work and people may also abuse this. (Such as purposefully creating accounts to get capped) (I mean it's bound to happen, just look at older incidents such as MP2s in the HC)

Feb's stats are also somewhat insane. (They would rival MP5s)

Simply lowering his VE wouldn't suffice. (I do have counter rituals against High VE rituals but due to his insanely high stats it's almost worthless)

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he leaves a def rit that can cap newbies
he has demonstrated enough knowledge about fighting
that to claim it wasn't his intention to cap newbs is full of [color=purple][bleep][/color]
leaving only one truth: he leaves a harmful def rit = he has full knowledge and all intentions to harm newbs
he knows what he's doing
ignorance or claim of no intention will not hold up in court

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If you had bothered to read the rest of the posts, Falsh, you would understand what we have been fighting against with people who don't seem to understand the issue.

We have been repeating over and over again that February is a damaging player-- not an asset.

Newbies who get capped at mp3 without any kind of knowledge of how to play the game go on to mp4, and get theirselves stuck in stat damage because they don't know how to set up a decent ritual, or even how to use some of the basics, I am sure.

February, upon this thread being made, has not changed his ways, from what I have understood, and continues to do as he has been. An innocent man would change what he does, and get himself back straight and narrow. February is not. He follows a crooked path for a crooked player with the malicious intent of capping newbies. :/

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Just so you people know, I have spotted February hidding in Necrovion. And he hasn't had any creatures to defend himself, making me think that he either sacrificed them all or gave them away or simply has them killed for now without restoring their vitality in order to fight. Saying that he continues to damage people when really he isn't, is a false accusation.

Now, for the fact that he has already damaged enough mp3s and there is proof of it, I won't deny that. I do not know whether he has been punished for it though. Also for your information, February is only the tip of the iceberg. I bet that there are other mp3s out there, alts or not, who are already training to walk in his shoes. Some mp5s we even have now, started this way. So this is an endless chain of events. There will always be someone who targets the weaker mp3s in order to push them to mp4. February was only one of them and his issue happened to be known to the community.

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So do what to him? Reduce his stats and vitality, as well remove the creatures from him? Would that make others happy? I am aware that because of him we no longer get vitality bonuses from angiens whereas he has already benefit himself from it. I doubt jailing him would do any difference.

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[quote name='Curiose' timestamp='1285016399' post='68752']
Newbies who get capped at mp3 without any kind of knowledge of how to play the game go on to mp4, and get theirselves stuck in stat damage because they don't know how to set up a decent ritual, or even how to use some of the basics, I am sure.
[/quote]
Stat damage at mp4, because they advance a day sooner? Most people I see advancing to mp4 are very very young and very excited about the advance. They're nowhere near having enough age to max an elemental yet. mp3 is the training ground most people try to skip as fast as possible and most vets will claim, if a noob asks, to be totally unimportant and 100% rectifiable on mp4/5.


To the people I see posting PL entries like 'this player is a coward and knows only one ritual, that's not strategy.. he's always hiding blah blah blah': you sound like sore losers and don't get the definition of strategy. If it works, don't fix it. If you can't win, run/hide. Such is definitely strategy. People who post things like that on the other hand, either hope to look superior or to convince their target to change their ways. I'm certain it's ineffective. So who is failing at strategy now?

To februari and anyone who wants to imitate him: you've made your point, your method worked. Doing it again is not original though, so find a new goal.

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Doing it again is not possible anymore. Find a new way so we can block that path also. You know...it started to be fun being on the other side. Let's see what method they can come up with and what we can do to stop them. It's a game of cat and mouse right now. So...enjoy it! :(

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[quote name='Kafuuka' timestamp='1285018876' post='68758']
To the people I see posting PL entries like 'this player is a coward and knows only one ritual, that's not strategy.. he's always hiding blah blah blah': you sound like sore losers and don't get the definition of strategy. If it works, don't fix it. If you can't win, run/hide. Such is definitely strategy. People who post things like that on the other hand, either hope to look superior or to convince their target to change their ways. I'm certain it's ineffective. So who is failing at strategy now?
[/quote]

Are we being criticized for what we think? Wow i didnt know our personal opinions can be right/wrong...

As poster of one of these said comments, i have no intention to try and "change" his ways. I have posted my reflection of said person. To my knowledge, he uses one ritual, again and again. So that would justify "he only knows one ritual".

I personally see those logs as our "views" of said player, and if i believe he only knows one ritual, and is a coward (only kills his crits so he doesnt lose, only shouts about the battles he wins, forgets the battles he hasnt) then im going to post that. And if you want to call me a fool about that then please do, because it is my personal opinion.

I would recommend you dont try to "assume" what people are trying to do, it only makes an ass out of you.

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do nothing.
different people walk different paths. just because someone is diffeent doesnt mean that he has to be lynched.
is strength the only measurement of which mp level someone should be? if it is than lots of people should be given a chance to step one or two mp levels down...
is it ok to ruin other people game experience? ofcourse its not. but limiting whole community because of isolated cases is ruining game experience too..

reason for EDIT: to clear a little bit what i ment

im against forcing people
im against punishing the whole community for bad deeds of minority
im for dealing with those who cause problems on purpose

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