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The true Eclipse - that is as distinguished from the "official" Eclipse who took our badges - has renewed its Pact with the leaders of Necrovion, Peace and Azull.

[size=5][b]Pact of the Sands[/b][/size]

These are the terms of the pact between the forces of Necrovion and the Children of the Eclipse, one people, one purpose.

I. War:

The forces of Necrovion and the Children of the Eclipse shall not make war against each other. In situations where other alliances (as in that between the Eclipse and the Guardians of the Root) might force the two parties into conflict, both parties hereby agree to refuse to engage each other in warfare.

II. Peace:

The forces of Necrovion and the Children of the Eclipse may engage each other in duels. Individual members of each party may, however, request not to be attacked by the other, and the leaders of both parties agree to ensure that such requests are honored.­­­

III. Information:

The forces of Necrovion and the Children of the Eclipse agree to share information on an ethical basis. Knowledge of advanced game mechanics and “spoilers” shall only be shared in case of emergency, but otherwise members of both parties shall be encouraged to share theories and discoveries pertaining to the nature of the realm of MagicDuel.

This Pact was re-confirmed by Tarquinus, Amoran, Peace, and Azull.

The "official" CoE has no bearing on this Pact and is not subject to its terms, just as it is not subject to our oaths or ceremonies. We cannot be held responsible for that group's actions.

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This post of mine is presuming you still consider yourselves Lorerootian (I have no reason to think otherwise), and also looking into the future when there might be some sort of land hierarchy again, even if that isn't kings anymore.

If the hierarchy of Loreroot decide it should go to war with Necrovion, you would not? You would go against the decision of the land, in essence rebelling from it? Would you then aid Necrovion, or just "ignore" the warring?

I would argue that as nice as this treaty sounds, you haven't thought through the consequences - Not just because of the above questioning, but also because of various other things which would heavily conflict your interests.

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[quote name='Grido' timestamp='1328808926' post='103899']
If the hierarchy of Loreroot decide it should go to war with Necrovion, you would not? You would go against the decision of the land, in essence rebelling from it? Would you then aid Necrovion, or just "ignore" the warring?[/quote]
By the terms of the Pact, we would not join the war. This is a dire hypothetical and we would do our utmost to prevent its coming to pass. If open war were declared between Loreroot and Necrovion, the Eclipse would remain neutral. There are further hypotheticals, such as Necrovion invading Loreroot, and that is something that we clearly, as defenders of Loreroot, cannot allow.

The previous terms of the Pact were legalistic and very specific. It is my opinion that we should trust each other to act in good faith and work out the nitty-gritty details as they arise. The Pact I have posted above is a much simplified version that presupposes good faith and cooperative spirit. I do take your point about conflicts of interest, but my opinion is, oh, what the hell. It's just a game, and the worst thing that can happen is that something interesting and unpredicted will happen.

I could be wrong. But I'm willing to take the chance, in the name of fun and good relations in the game.

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Seig, I specifically mentioned land hierarchy, even if it isn't kings, and land hierarchies would naturally tend to develop, even without mechanical interference.

By remaining neutral when your land is part of a war, you could (not would) well be seen to be traitors to the land - you would be using the weight of your members to influence your land's politics in favour of Necrovion, rather than itself. I say in favour of them, because it may not be able to act without assistance from yourselves, which according to this statement, you would not give.

Long-term agreements rarely work on good faith, each side believes different things about the pact that the other half wouldn't agree to if known. The good faith view of the pact is different for both parties.

Interesting and unpredicted things are all good fun, but then I ask what the point of making the pact is at all, if it's all based on good faith, and you want such things to happen. In my opinion, if you write terms, you write them properly, or you just don't do it.

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You argue valid points and hypothetical concerns - but they do not take into account that the CoE has had a defensive pact with Necrovion allies years. We have witnessed the disbandment of the Sentinels and 'takeover' of the CoE, and felt it prudent to solidify and reinvigorate this pact - one reason being the significant shifting of alliance members.

And doesn't any mutual agreement and consensus-based decision assume an inherent 'faith' that all parties will abide by it?

Edited by Phantom Orchid
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one case scenario that would look interestin would be followin: nv attack lr, coe "stays neutral and tries to calm down situation" while in fact they are in conspiracy with necros to overthrow *insert name of new hierarchical body here* and get in charge instead of them

oke this is interestin scenario which has 99% chances of not happenin :D ofc

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