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Spent credits shop list

Muratus del Mur

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Why shouldn't I ask for at least a portion on my alts to be counted as this is a reward for the player? This just shows that each case is individual and should be treated as such.


As I said before, this is generous of Mur in any case, but fairness should be implemented.

@Sasha: which "player" ? each character is unique and you have to play it separately. If you choose to give money as one or another ... then you will receive the credit on only them. and that is fair.

In change, Items can be transferred and you can do whatever you want with it and this is fair.


Asking for others to adjust your history it is not fair.



I agree on the greed situation, as much as you may say otherwise. I asked a general question about money on alts, this caused a discussion and I answered back. I don't expect it for just myself, I'd expect it for no one or everyone.


I've been in the realm for over four years (or something like that), I highly doubt I spent even 3 months of that time in jail. I'd have had plenty of opportunity. Especially considering the MDShop still works in jail, I'd have just used it for personal gain.

I don't think that either me (No one) or Everyone want special treatment but thank you for asking.


Personal credits are there for personal gain only and for all MD due to server support.

So nobody will deny you the right to use your credit as you see fit but you should not ask for more the you deserve. That is not cool.


How about, if someone wants to transfer their purchased credits, either spent/unspent totals, or both, to another account, they can do so only once, but then have the account locked from making any further subscriptions/money orders through that account? This way they can still vote if they want to for the free credits and all, but the abuse gets limited.

Transferring credits is forbidden and not possible for a long time (all cases are dealt with by the councils) as it can be abused in so many ways.

Adding the things you said might be fair but only in some conditions and for only a few ppl and could add so many possibilities for abuses that it can be discarded from the beginning with :

"NO, transfers of credit (of any kind) is not possible."


My suggestion to you: if you want to use the credits on your alts then get all your alts to 200$ of spent credits and to have patience.

By the way: it is not smth I would do as I only play on only 1 / one character and it alone deserve my credit.

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Laws, whether codified under kelsenian positivism or supported by a vast jurisprudence in a system of common law, which is to say, law by precedent, ultimately rely on an alleged impartiality from magistrates and juries which, human beings integrating their respective societies, are all to partial, the same as the code itself is, whether by its heritage to the sovereign unit's culture or whether to the extension it serves the interests of those atop the social construct of hierarchy.


Such impartiality does not, however, exist, and should not even be expected to exist in this scenario. What I see here is one side arguing for benefits it feels entitled to and another arguing against the existence of one such an entitlement. Therefore, the real subject of this discussion is the matter of entitlement.


Credits serve but a single purpose as far as the whole is concerned, the maintenance of the basic financial supports necessary for the game's continued existence. That they are imperative towards the whole's continuity does not, however, mean that one such  a position bears entitlement.


While one might expect those buyers to see it as a donation with benefits, it is true that, being ultimately proposed as a shop, you are truly entitled to those items you purchase. This, however, is not an entitlement you've paid for in an agreed upon contract, unspoken or otherwise, but rather, a gift.


That which you were entitled to has already been received, and that is the original credits; this is a gift, and as such, one cannot speak of fair or unfair, for it is already a privilege, and a privilege that, devoid of entitlement, should go under whichever criteria the giver would rather opt for. No less and no more.


That said, the criteria chosen was that your credits spent be considered on a per account basis, and while nothing prevents you from asking that lesser amounts be considered for those rewards, that is a personal request, not an universal and taken for  granted right.


This is not an issue of greed, because greed we all indulge in, in our own respective ways, even if we are indoctrinated from birth to think that false, but rather, merely entitlement has been assumed where there is none


In a sense, have you lost on potential gains in view of having put credits in other accounts? Certainly. Is it likely that you put those credits in other accounts with good intentions, as you claim? I don't see why not. That certainly might be enough reason for Mur to decide to gift you on the entirety of your spent credits, whether on those respective accounts or on a primary one, but fair or unfair play no part in that decision. 

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[read it all, its good]


In a sense, have you lost on potential gains in view of having put credits in other accounts? Certainly. Is it likely that you put those credits in other accounts with good intentions, as you claim? I don't see why not. That certainly might be enough reason for Mur to decide to gift you on the entirety of your spent credits, whether on those respective accounts or on a primary one, but fair or unfair play no part in that decision. 


Bravo, Someone who sees the spent credit shop for what it is.

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I don't understand this part at all.  Can you give an example?




Certainly. Whereas, here, I used the contrast merely as a key to open the argument with, it is ultimately widely accepted that most of the world uses one of two systems in the typification of their legal systems, common law and civil law, with a few mixed exceptions, as well as those nations which use sharia, religious law as written by the prophet.


The earlier relates back, though neither should be seen as a direct continuity, to the Code of Justinian¹, and refers to systems built on statutory law, which is to say, law as written, a tradition further reinforced by Kelsen's General Theory of Law and State in 20th century Germany, but which can be found earlier, for instance, in the Napoleonic Code. Kelsen's primary contribution in that regard was the institution of positivist doctrine, laws as written and absolute, but one would do well not to close oneself to different perspectives here.


The later, most well known for its prevalence in the US and the United Kingdom, is built on case law, law by precedent, Unlike civil law, common law was for a long time a system strictly detained to the British Island, however, with the British Empire, most of its subsidiaries would, even after their independence, continue to adopt the system, as is the case with India and the US.


In effect, the key topic to be understood in that regard is that a civil law system seeks to maintain its integrity by the universal application of a same given set of codified laws, whereas previous cases, though they might be used as an argument in the absence of the letter of the law, have no imperative value. On the other hand, common law systems seek to main their integrity not in relying in a single typified code, but rather, by relying on precedent so as to ensure that a given sentence, in a given situation, does not vary from another, therefore maintaining its internal consistency. 


That said, let us move on to the matter of bias in a given legal system, and to what extent the point of any given system is a subjective form of justice or another subject altogether. This, being an ardent discussion in the field, rather than a widely accepted classification, I will only loosely approach.


There are two areas widely open to personal influence in any given system, the creation of the laws themselves, which is to say, the legislative body or entity, and the application of these laws, the trial proper, embodied in those magistrates presiding over the sentence, as well as the jury, should the system sponsor trial by such.


In the earlier, we must admit that, even though justice by those common standards of the nation may well be within the legislative body's interests, to say that is their sole interest would be foolhardy at best as an expectation to be assumed upon a fellow human being, And I speak of those common standards of the nation because, ultimately, many aspects of morality are intrinsically cultural, even as the widespreadness of a given set of western values might have led us to believe we've found common human values were there are, in fact, none.


That is not say all of them are, or that I can state objectively which are and which are not. Far from it, if anything, I'd just likewise fall within a cultural standard. That is not to say, however, that tolerance is always the answer; while many of us are taught that from birth as a quintessential value, ultimately, the tolerant who passively stands before the intolerant is just waiting idly for their own destruction or subversion. Here, there is no truth to be found.


That considered, the interests that permeate a given legislative body or entity are manifold; moral values, political interests, personal interests and even mood affect the legislator's decision the same as they would any other individual's, and though certain similarities might remain, not even the moral values are the same for every legislator. Thus, it becomes increasingly difficult to conceive any given legal framework as a work of  platonic justice, even judged by the nation's average standards; here, though this is not the start and end of the matter, a convenient simplification would be to say that one such a framework is, first and foremost, a convenient imposition.


Once we move on to the application of that framework, we are forced to add yet another layer of personality, as that system created by a given legislative body or derived from previous trials is once more subjected to interpretation². The presiding magistrate, those parties directly involved, their advocates and, if present, the jury, each have their own established moral framework, when not even personal interests in the trial's outcome, acting as yet another personal filter through which so called justice might be delivered.


Unless law is deemed absolute and perfect as written², and one might then decide to altogether forego trial, these joint particularities will then serve as the final lens through which those original intentions, whichever they be, emanating from the legislative, will be distorted and cast into effect, that is, the sentence itself. More often than not, it is where the outcome agrees with our view that we call it just, and where it disagrees that we call it unjust.


So long as the legal framework does not operate in a fashion thus conflicting so as to alienate large enough a part of the population to jeopardize the present system's legitimacy before the public, so does the framework continue to be considered sufficiently just by the majority and, in tandem, remain legitimate justice. Though there are a few things to be said as to absolute and/or universal values, we would then go from an analysis  on the overall framework of legality to a territory deeply ingrained in my own set of beliefs, and so it is for best that we cut this short. I hope it is of some use.


In hindsight, this may well have deviated much too far away from the thread's general intent; please feel free to delete this post if you believe it necessary.


¹consuetudinary law, a tradition most widespread through the  Middle Ages, emphasizing local customs, rather than precedent or an unified system as written. Of Germanic tradition, though one should also note it did have a measure of influence in ancient Roman law, customary systems were slowly abandoned as national States formed, for, as they sought to take  power from local elites and empower the bureaucracy, and as the scale of administration rose, so were increasingly standardized systems sought and implemented. Nowadays, for reasons all too similar, customary law, where it still exists, detains a subordinate role in the legal hierarchy.


²even civil law systems have this characteristic, codified as they may have become, for written law so clearly stated and weighed thus devoid of external influences that there is no room for argument has not yet been conceived. This is, ultimately, a flaw in Kelsen's predominantly scientific view of Law, in which positive law might consistently adapted in progressive fashion in accordance to the State's desires, rather than being constantly mutated by manifold interests.

Edited by Azthor
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  • 2 months later...

Mur mailed me the SQL used, I am under the impression its slightly wrong, This would be the revised list if I am correct, which includes Eon.

playername | ID | Active Days | Tickets | Tickets Used
Zleiphneir 77300 1556 10 0
Nava 184261 521 10 0
Ailith 80963 986 9 0
*Shemhazaj* 143975 1712 8 2
Ratbert 198665 905 7 0
Jolla 217374 905 7 0
Menhir 202298 1215 7 0
Azull 202015 1256 7 1
Tal 214701 1001 7 0
Kyphis 104972 1764 7 1
darkraptor 193670 1184 6 0
Handy Pockets 136253 1510 6 1
Dayredeemer 109921 866 6 1
Manda 182380 1212 6 0
BigC 10213 336 6 0
Princess Katt 202952 802 5 0
duxie 208462 729 5 0
Yoshi 169242 604 5 1
Lady Aster 10080 591 5 0
Shoeps 12996 1053 5 0
MRG 38304 641 5 0
Junior 43448 1846 5 0
BlackThorn 54807 420 5 0
Mystic 104274 995 5 1
Akasha 1014 2175 5 0
sasha lilias 148016 743 5 1
lashtal 221376 969 5 0
Eon 67640 1182 4 2


bump?  :P

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  • 6 months later...

omg...thanks for reminding me about it!!!!!


I need to stop/finish working on a25 first, and probably make some preparations for christmas..sadly these are priority because if i dont finish the details on current a25 feature , it will get lost forever in the corners of my memory


and if i dont do anything at all for christmas preparations ..i cant do it AFTER


you sure understand


i wont be doing any christmas preparations in rl, none to spend it with, so i wil have more time to work on md, lets hope i will get more things done


Someone please poke me about this


and if someone knows whats the current stage of it (tehnically speaking, only chew could know), tellll meee


you see thats wy i need additional live memory of tech things. Come on, make that memory happen. it will save my life :)


Edited by Muratus del Mur
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  • 1 month later...

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