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The Great Pashweetie

Sparring Ground's Dissapoinment

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Well whats the use if the sparring grounds isnt used properly? Every day im ruined there because i either want to talk to a friend or was just stopping bye to tell everyone something... and what do you know... im attacked! it happens nearly every day and its very annoying, this is more of a rant because i know there isnt much to improve it. Share your frustrations, or go ahead and yell at me :D.

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Note: You can say you get attacked, without any proof I won't listen to anything.

If you truly feel that bad about it, get some solid proof (did you actually PM those hitting you, asking whether they knew and such POLITELY?) onto this and we'll see.

And if you wonder, yes, I don't trust your words easily like this because you have no good reputation (yet) in my eyes, although I believe you got hit a few times.

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so? i believe jz walking around in the realm invites attacking
you have to accept this as a fact of life whenever you go out of sanctuaries
yeah there are places like SG or whatever that has rules such as don't attack unless idle etc, etc..
but seriously, why count on ppl following rules? if someone is strong enough to flaunt the rules, do you think they'd follow?

when i go to park, i expect to be pummeled to death
regardless of whether i'm idle or not
some of those who can give me positive honor do a hit and run tactic :D
as if i can damage them! lol

since i can reasonably expect others attacking me, what do i do?
simple, i just put up single crit defs to preserve my VE
then i can walk around anywhere without being afraid all my creatures will just be wiped out in one attack

attack cooldown still works you know
the same person can't attack you for a time

what about successive attacks from different players?

have successive single rit defs
so that when one dies, another single crit rit will follow it

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This is basically for anyone to follow:

If you encounter someone who is violating the rules:

You either A. Tell them in public to follow the rules [or in PM] so as to have valid proof.
B. If they continue to harrass/violate, then you tell an LHO with specifics and proof.
C. Things will be taken from there by someone strong enough/politically adept enough to deal with the issue.

That's about all I can think of at the moment. [[i]At the moment.[/i]]

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Yeah, make them aware of the rules, then if they continue to ignore them, retaliate.

It does bother me when I see mp5s tell people that the rules are just a "suggestion". Mp3s and mp4s appreciate a common area to test their rituals and chat. Just because we mp5s are not covered by the SP doesn't mean that we shouldn't encourage mp3s and mp4s to utilize the rules and create community there. The community created by friendly interaction at the park will last through to their promotion to mp5.

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If I am not mistaken, I recall a similar incident about mp5s as well, but the community decided that mp5 is much more advanced mindpower level to 'ask for permission' thus the rules were only for mp3 and mp4.

I haven't seen yet any mp5 saying that the SG is only a suggestion and who ever wants it, follows it or not. But if that is the case, then I am disappointed. Don't forget that we were mp3 and mp4 once, the older players should remember how we needed a place to train without being attacked randomly by everyone.

If you want to avoid future complaints as this, then I would suggest having people there who reinforce the rules. Yes, staff is what I mean. A person alone can't do evertything. A signpost isn't enough.

Also a retaliation, like Nadrolski suggested, sounds like the best thing for me.

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I spoke with Shadow about having a staff, but.. somehow the verdict on that came muddled and I cannot remember exactly what it was at this particular moment.

Basically, if someone could come up with a good solution/staff idea for it, I think it could be implemented. I brought up the idea of using Mya's advanced strip spell idea to him with hopes that would work, but once more,my tired brain does not remember the exact verdict. I think it was turned down.

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There is no way to enforce rules upon players. Moreover, since this is a community project, you'll not gain specific spells/items to maintain it. Yes, at the beginning they were such things but they got abused so they were removed.
And even with spells/items you still can't force a player to do/not to do a thing (remember GGG and phantasm's item).

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that's why I suggested letting people to fight (in sense of forcing the creatures needed to be trained, not damaging other people with negative xp just for the sake of destruction, and not putting creatures that "ensure" farming wins at such level. Maybe someone has few drachorns, what do I know, there you all complained at February's angiens for example), cause in "wilderness" you evolve instead of having restrictions without a base. It's like having laws without a police, maybe it can work for a transition period, but you can't keep it for ever and ever "as a good and proved system".

While having that "semi restricted FFA" as Redd called it when he heard about the idea, those who feel like helping those in need, and I think mostly about the mp6s, should stick around the Marble Dale Park and heal the wounded, give attack/defense boosts to those that are weaker... even handicap (in sense of fighting spells) those mp3/4s that are "a bit" stronger than the others, for the sake of fun and balance, so everyone has a chance...

it's an idea.

When that was presented I got raided by number of people who glorified the current system of Sparring Grounds, how it works just fine... well it doesn't look like that.

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With Mp6, a lot of them have things to do, than sit in the park. I personally, would not enjoy being restricted to an area playing babysitter and making sure the kiddies play nice.

As for the community project thing, it was discussed to have the people choose who would be best to run the park and such like that. Shadow was contacted only for permission.

But I do understand what you mean, Dst.

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Before anyone gets to this staff thing again...

I simply point to my own experiences. When I was idle, or even active there all time, how often would you believe did I receive PMs regarding anything?

In fact, not more than a couple each week, there was even periods where NONE came in.

Thus, I would say, no staff. And even if it came to staff, I personally can say, I could count the people I'd probably think of with one hand...not only for the newbies, but also for the people being staff themselves.


Staff, to do what?

I'm afraid I have to disagree, the SG was implemented to alter the attitude of the players a bit, essentially making them more aware of helping themselves, and not relying on an imperfect protection. Heck, if anything/anyone major comes to disturb of it, I (hopefully) would hear of it, or others, who would tell me.

SG was based around mechanic-based punishment, and I dislike the idea of implementing a new staff other than those I'd think of, because they would need special powers again, if you asked me.

Just let there be a community, if it really is threatened by single or several people, they will be dealt with. If I left by then, there's still the other players here, apparently thinking of it, no?

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[quote]I haven't seen yet any mp5 saying that the SG is only a suggestion and who ever wants it, follows it or not. But if that is the case, then I am disappointed. Don't forget that we were mp3 and mp4 once, the older players should remember how we needed a place to train without being attacked randomly by everyone.[/quote]

Remember what? I don't remember what I did as MP3 but I think it was largely resurrecting my creatures and hoping for the best. As MP4, I was frequently found at willows shop and if I wasn't I was either hunting, recruiting or doing a quest. The better part of MP4 I spent in alliance. I am actually disappointed that you do not considered past what you've experienced.

Of course there is an alternative interpretation, if you are insinuating that I (and other players) actually NEEDED a place to train without getting attacked and that it is a miracle we have gotten this far. In this case I feel I have gravely overestimated you.

As for the 'training grounds' on MP3/4. I will not stand against them as long as they are not enforced by powers beyond 'normal' players (ao only WP/MP6 spells), the training is not mainly intended to increase anything but ritual knowledge and the training is not intended to unbalance the game.

On MP5, I will simply use training grounds or disobey them as it suits me. Unless something should be largely amiss, in which case I will attempt to break it.

I will not hold it against MP3/4 to do the same on their MP. Just because something is controversial doesn't make it wrong. However in my opinion, alts/ancient MP3/4 whom decide to beat up, cap or cause creature exp loss on other MP3/4 should be dealt with harshly.

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As there is no practical way to prevent violators,
the own players must pull together if someone constantly attacks the other MP3 / 4 even
being advised, all others must join forces to retaliate against the attacker.

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Ah i see what you guys mean, but the real problem are the people with several shop creatures who run by with fully recharged creatures and then run away the next second, they wipe out everything i have :P.

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That's one of the points of the Sparring Ground, actually. To learn about rituals and other fighting aspects, NOT to train your creatures. One of the very basics of creature survival in MD is knowing to set cannon fodder defenses (unless you intend to set stronger defenses to gain wins, but only if you're confident in your ability, and don't mind losses as "all rits are counterable"). I spent quite a long time on MP4, but I don't remember ever having any problem surviving once I get to setting up proper defenses..

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[quote name='Curiose' timestamp='1286174370' post='69607']
B. If they continue to harrass/violate, then you tell an LHO with specifics and proof.
[/quote]

Do not do B. Lhos do not guard the SG, they are to help new players but this is not the help we are meant to give. We are not affliated with the SG and therefore cannot stop people attacking there.

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If someone unjustly attacks you then you should do these things-

Steps to report
1. Take a screenshot of the battlescene/battlelog (press Alt+PrintScreen and then paste it into paint, GIMP, etc...)
2. Send attacker a PM asking why and wait for reply or if no reply in next 10-20 minutes don't wait
3. Send a Pm to SG authorities with the screenshot attached aswell as the reasons the attacker stated or if they didn't reply/you didn't ask

It's simple and easy.
Note: SG no-attack rules do not apply to Mp5.

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you know i so hate the idea of a sparing grounds. when it went into effect i said that is a stupid idea.

the game isn't about farming wins it is about learning what you can't and can do with your creatures. now if you want to tell me after a few days or weeks you don't have a clue to what you can do then i suggest you might want to look at how YOUR playing!

since they can't limit the SG to just when you first learn thing's i don't think they should limit it to forever as mp3/4 levels. i will point out another thing, this sparing grounds is one of the biggest reasons people have become so overpowered you can just sit here free from a random creature killing rit and just grind your stats all day! the game wasn't made this way it became this way due to a bad decision and i sure hope it is removed!

edited for this: when i was mp3/4/5 there wasn't a SG we would sit in sanctuary and either PM one another or talk then go outside to fight. you don't need any more safer places then this. sure sometimes someone came along and blasted you but that's life, and the game should bring back this random chance to it! Edited by pipster

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