Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Kamisha

Land Timer

  

27 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

Ok I have already found a problem with non-land players having only 90 action points. Simply the ability to get into locations with 100AP requires you to have a land. For example I would have to be part of Marnidbell. I understand the incentive is to increase the incentive to join a land more so then before but complete restriction of certain areas which where not restricted before is not an effective method. If things stay like this I can expect a large amount of people to disappear by the end of next month without fail.
You cant simply change one thing and expect to get away with it. When you change something everything else has to change with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Or you could use stuff to increase your AP... Getting AP above max is not really that hard.

Although, I do agree that probably those areas should get lowered to 90AP requirements.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Kamisha' date='24 March 2010 - 08:09 AM' timestamp='1269439754' post='56834']
Ok I have already found a problem with non-land players having only 90 action points. Simply the ability to get into locations with 100AP requires you to have a land. For example I would have to be part of Marnidbell. I understand the incentive is to increase the incentive to join a land more so then before but complete restriction of certain areas which where not restricted before is not an effective method. If things stay like this I can expect a large amount of people to disappear by the end of next month without fail.
You cant simply change one thing and expect to get away with it. When you change something everything else has to change with it.
[/quote]

The entire point of lowering the max AP for people without a land is so that they have to work harder to get into places that require 100 AP to enter. You expect a bunch of people to leave because they need a burst to get into Angien's Shrine? Requiring someone to know game mechanics to enter an area promotes interest in the game, it doesn't lessen it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No, they shouldn't. [That was meant for Udgards 90 AP idea]


It's insanely easy to get over 100 AP, and in this one thing, allies have an advantage now.
You can change one thing and leave everythign else as it is, no problem there, we've had that quite a few times^^ Edited by Burns

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Udgard' date='24 March 2010 - 02:18 PM' timestamp='1269440315' post='56835']
Or you could use stuff to increase your AP... Getting AP above max is not really that hard.Although, I do agree that probably those areas should get lowered to 90AP requirements.
[/quote]

Some areas should be harder to get into, it makes it fairer. For exmaple. To recruit angiens, you would need to get to 100 ap to be able to get in. making them cost 100 ap doesnt limit you to get to 99% of the areas, its just a few special places that you cant access.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, even if you say so..

Just by stacking some AP boosts..you should be able to get over 200 AP easily. 200, starting from 110 max.

And..if you are even more clever, and set up things in a grand way, I guess 250-300 AP isn't impossible.

Why not just wait and think how to attain something with what you have instead of trying to get something you do not have?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It adds an extra challenge. And you don't even need to use all of your free credits to get the 100ap if you were at max to begin with. It also helps to prevent MP3s from spending 100 ap to get to an island where they can't do anything (they wouldn't be able to get Angiens normally). Also, its a good way to encourage people to look at citizenship or alliance membership. Its not like the change left people with no options and its is only one or two locations in MD that are affected. And the other timers were also tweaked, Necrovion's was increased and their max ap dropped. We did seek to create a balance and a purpose with the changes, not just shaft people or give ourselves unfair advantages.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ever heard of free credits? this is the best change of all. either u support the game by voting in order to enter or u understand the battle machinics and have various different ways in with that. or u could just become citizen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Have you thought of the implementations. If I was ever going to become a Loreroot member I have tossed that thought out the window. I mean think about this. Lets just lay this out.
Loreroot: Remains
Marnidbell: Angiens
Goloumus: Drakhorns
Novocron: Shades

These are the 4 lands signature creatures. Soon to be 5 if the eastern lands is completed. Look at this logically. What is your least favorite of these or the least useful the one that has a close substitute. Thats the remains. The Grasan is the closest imitation to the Drakhorn Angiens I am unsure and same with shades. The only difference between remains and a barren soul is that the remains have the ability to boost regen. Then how do you get to it. Well simple no huge Ap to enter and a normal recruit cost. Any sensible person who has there personal best interest in mind would join a different land in order to get a truly unique creature.
This will simply unbalance the torch competition even more. Create a very simple 1 type of creature environment and unbalance the fight system as well as the trade system as people choose to trade for those three inaccessible creatures instead of just the two.
I believe in just about 3 weeks we will see a result of people using this to there advantage. In the first three weeks the trading is going to shift just too the three lands. Then by the ends of the third month the creature rituals will simplify as people realize they can take as many of these creatures as they want and not be rivaled by anything of greater ability. I mean whats going to stop this we already have rituals of just drakhorns with huge amounts of tokens.

I'm not saying things are going to get harder I am simply saying the diversity of the game is going to become restricted due to this change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The saddest thing is that in a week or so some of you will pm me about "a bug that 90 ap is not enough to enter or upgrade some things". It usually happens with old players not with those new.

The suggestions the kings made are by far better than what i had in mind. I would suggest 70ap for normal players and slower timers. Of course you would say its insane, but only if you compare with whats now. Seeing it "from scratch" is harder than it seems. A new player should discover the game with lower settings and later get it "faster". What you do its like arguing that a new player cant recruit a Grasan on its first day and see that as an issue.

Makes me laugh when you say i am driving people away with such changes...you should see whats coming.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
That makes no sense at all...

How does a lower max ap, and we are still talking of 90, not 60 or 70, change anything about the diversity of creatures?
Do you think that Lorerootians and Golemians used no creatures with a high ap-cost because it took us slightly longer than normal to recruit them?

Or that we avoided Maple Road because the cost was too high? LOL

It was about calculating what you can and can't do, and how long it takes you, nothing more... It took me 4 hours to upgraded my remains, sacc them, and get new ones, so what? Doesn't change anything...

And, being as old as you are, you should know that drachs and shades are inaccessible, so there is no recruitment cost for those, and Angiens are something newbies shouldn't have anyway.

Btw, comparing trees to hollows? What's going on in your mind, kiddo?

Whatever point you tried to make, it failed xD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Muratus del Mur' date='24 March 2010 - 02:58 PM' timestamp='1269460707' post='56854']
The saddest thing is that in a week or so some of you will pm me about "a bug that 90 ap is not enough to enter or upgrade some things". It usually happens with old players not with those new.

The suggestions the kings made are by far better than what i had in mind. I would suggest 70ap for normal players and slower timers. Of course you would say its insane, but only if you compare with whats now. Seeing it "from scratch" is harder than it seems. A new player should discover the game with lower settings and later get it "faster". What you do its like arguing that a new player cant recruit a Grasan on its first day and see that as an issue.

Makes me laugh when you say i am driving people away with such changes...you should see whats coming.
[/quote]

With all due respect I do agree with a lot of your ideas they are necessary to evolve the game to its full potential. Though every once and a while you do come to the crossroad where you have to decide that this isn't the right move. I did think about the upgrade thing though I don't think as many people would actually look at it seriously.

When you say what changes are coming I can see a lot of positive things though I look at somethings and just have to question them. I have only been getting feedback from alliance members so obviously my topic is biased to the positive side of it but I see long term negatives.

I mean I looked at the active days wishpoint negatively because a lot of players would be using to many spells that would alter play to the point that finding people to attack would be impossible. Though it is hard to hide who you are as a ghost you cant attack one. You cant successfully fight a mirror ect. I just think somethings should be implicated and limiting some things is fine but actually yanking out and deconstructing profiles for those that would perfere or in some cases have to remain neutral causes some real problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Considering the vp needed for angiens and later ve that they need for evolving I believe these new setting dont affect a newby player whatsoever. Besides, as some stated, there are ways of raising ap. And, a newby should be focused on other things than getting the strongest crits possible, angien should in a way be holy-grail instead of "a bit better aramor". If its harder now to get to some areas, well, thats good. It makes them a bit more special. If informations are not given out on silver plater, why would acceses to lands be. And if alliance members have a bit of advantage over non-alliance ones now, well, I find that good also considering that there are also negative effects from it. And on the other hand, it is good if newby learnes to "slow-pace", gives more time to actualy think of what you are doing, why you are doing it and how you will do it. Anyhow, I believe the changes are good. I might be wrong, but thats on time to show.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I do not agree at all with your "signature creatures." Drachorns, remains, Angiens, and Shades are all on vastly different planes of complexity. Have you ever heard remains speak? What about Drachorns?

The fact remains that each land is different, and instead of striving for equality we should pay close attention to the nuances of each land.

Have you ever heard of the idea of linguistic determinism (credit to Whorf)? The theory is that a person will express themself in a different way, depending on which language they are speaking. I believe the bilingual people in MD can attest to this: a person sometimes feels that they act different and have different personalities in their two different languages.

I view the lands in a similar way. Each of them is a separate way of thinking, and the longer you spend in that land the more you begin to think in a particular way. I've had conversations with others (Jester, especially) about what makes a person a citizen of one land or another, and it is surprising how obvious it is which land a person belongs to. This stems from the fact that lands act as a lens through which people see the larger realm. The following are some oversimplifications of the trends (feel free to skip. The part related to the topic comes later):

Necrovions tend to more outwardly melancholy, and in fact seem to take pride in the less starkly moral actions. Insanity is a common theme, whether feigned or actual. Seem to struggle with right and wrong, and in the best of cases give up the struggle in favor of a more blanketing acceptance of the lack of a universal moral code.

Lorerootians on the other hand mention often the beauty of nature, and bowing to a spiritual ebb and flow. They also tend to be more simple in thought process, and are saved from a good deal of messy introspection and wallowing due to their strict adherence to the belief that nature is good and beautiful, and those that endanger it are bad.

Those from Marind Bell are fighters, knights that fight for there internally held beliefs. There is no greater ideal than martyrdom, which often times benefits the entire society. Politeness and respect are also forefront in the society of Marind Bell, and it is no accident that they are the caretakers of the new, the ones to initiate others into the realm. Who better than those with a sense of duty? There is also an eddy of education and study, though often times it appears to be steadfast in the search of good and truth.

The citizens of Golemus are somewhat divided. There is a large faction of those who love to tinker and explore. The pleasure of solutions and answers cannot be avoided, and in the search for the answers sometimes the more interrelated subtitles that are less cut and elegant are evaded. There is also a penchant for help and an altruistic tendency to educate all those that seek higher learning.

Okay, now that I've gotten my critique of your "signature creatures" out of my system, I still would like to say that I highly favor the new timers and the reduction of AP in wild card members, those who have not chosen a land.

I will say that it seems people care less and less about alliances, focusing more on the functional benefits of remaining a floater. I cannot stress enough that by putting an anchor into the land you will find the rewards are far greater than a faster attack timer. It is the next step in becoming a member of the realm. How many active and influential members are there that are not, or have not been, a member of an alliance?

So I think the increased pressure to join a land is acceptable, and totally in line with the principles (not those) of the realm.

Awi

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so Lorerootians are simple minded peasant-hippies, and people of Marind Bell are educated fine gentlemen a? :P


don't ever generalize things Awi.
each land has number of different, sometimes contradicting personalities, and what you're doing is creating some kind of stereotypes for lands.

And I like the idea of limiting APs slowing down the game, making things more limited to people (especially new ones), cause if you have everything open for you to reach it easily... well it just ain't right :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The thing about a stereotype is that rather than being a rule, one which all items in the society or list follow, it is a trend, something that a majority (it could be 51%) follow.

Awi

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I very much like the longer regen times for noncitizens, though I doubt newbies will enjoy it...


However, I dislike the 90 max AP. A 90 AP cap makes it harder to do as much in a certain timeframe, such as make attacks or run away from a pursuer.

If the point was to make it difficult to reach certain areas, it would be better, IMHO, to simply increase the cost of going there to something like 120 AP. I wouldn't mind that at all.


It'll take some time getting used to. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote name='Rhaegar Targaryen' date='25 March 2010 - 04:04 AM' timestamp='1269464665' post='56862']
so Lorerootians are simple minded peasant-hippies, and people of Marind Bell are educated fine gentlemen a? :D
[/quote]

Hahahahaha.....

Anyways, keep in mind that newbies does not need to get use to a new system. Its all new to them. They do not have the opportunity to compare before and after.

Alts will be a diff question as they know what it was before.

So, noobs is not an issue. The issue are the floaters and alts.

That is like a totally different point all together.

For now, the changes is to motivate players to join an alliance.

For those who insist on being floaters, it is by choice and they should know how to overcome their disadvantage from experience.

:P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exactly CrazyMike, and i am kind of full of complains coming from alts.
If non-aly ap were lets say 40ap, new players would still be OK and just desire the citizenship more..but most that complain compare with their current status.

I don't say i always take good decisions, this one wasn't even mine(!) , but i believe this is a good one that should have been so for a much longer time.

Of course is useful to see both pro and contra arguments.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

  • Forum Statistics

    16,111
    Total Topics
    175,965
    Total Posts
  • Recently Browsing

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Upcoming Events

    No upcoming events found
  • Recent Event Reviews

×
×
  • Create New...