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Roleplay: Ifs, Ands, And Buts...

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I want to know what you, the general players, consider to be good or bad role play. I don't consider this to be totally subjective as a topic either might I add, in some respects quite the opposite.

I will take one example. Someone decided to call me a small minded idiot recently over the issue of role play. I won't name the person for you, but the reason was that I consider turning into a giant black blob via one line of text, then eating the entirity of Bob in another line of text, then spitting him out in the next line of text - godmodding in it's most obvious form (quite apart from being lazy in the extreme) and he doesn't think that is modding at all.

So im interested in what the current population of MD feel about RP at the moment.

Z

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yeah, that's godmodding...

if they bulked it out a little then it's a bit better..but a line for each?

there is a number of players who godmod without thinking they are unfortunately, but there are also a number who know they're godmodding and still do it...

on the most part though people are sensible with their roleplay i think, as in actually acted out, instead of the one-liners.

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Heh, finally a topic about this.

TO be honest, I'm quite dissappointed at how the majority of RP is heading with MD right now. When I first joined MD, people had unique roles that is somehow based on the realm of MD. Right now a lot of RPers is roleplaying things that, based on the MD world's setting, doesn't seem to exist (demons, vampires, werewolves? -_-a). But I guess it's everyone's right to RP what they like.. And then the godmoddings.. Casting firebolt out of nowhere? Teleporting via magical portal blah3? Yeah, people are godmodding everywhere, and I can totally understand how you feel being called a small minded idiot by someone who did that amount of godmodding in just 3 lines of text...

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I do admit I sometimes godmod a bit, as in give shadow traits he shouldn't possess...

But everything has it's limits. The way you create something is easily said in a few lines, but it won'tbe affected by everyone:

1. Interaction. You can't just go around saying you'll kill everyone with just one swipe of a sword, give them a chance to bend it to their liking. So if you attack them, they can dodge or flee or hit back..whatever. The timing is crucial sometimes, which is why certain roleplay is more suited when you wait a bit, or else you dominate it too much. It's hard to find someone who fits your speed, sometimes.

2. Powers. Powers do exist, but you aren't a god. Things like dreams, creating fire out of nowhere are already borderline to me, but things like flying without wings/other means, being able to shoot lasers which destroy everything etc..are a bit unlikely and weird not? This most likely will be heavily critisized, but yeah...It should stay solid to a certain degree. If you are someone who can't read, how can you manage to decipher the ancient language nobody else gets? You hopefully understand what I mean.

3. Story. Roleplay is about stories. You can pick up strands left by other people, you can pick up on events and even as you roleplay you create stories. Roleplay is nothing but a way to express yourself and be creative, in a sense we are all writing one huge book named MD. I'm not sure what the sum of it is or what the standard is, but everything together forms MD, every single one of us. Shouldn't we aim to improve these stories? So they should be fun to read, write and also give us a feeling of satisfaction.

But yeah, what should I say? Not everyone would follow what I just wrote. Sadly enough, in my opinion.

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Obviously godmodding not in the least because they fail to state actions as intentions and give people the opportunity to react. I've put funny comments on that behavior in my papers long ago and I've seen others with similar remarks.
You are godmodding if:
a. Your characters' powers aren't just above average, but so far above average that average looks like a the sun at several light years away: a tiny dot.
b. You decide what happens to other peoples characters. This includes not giving them the opportunity to react to things any sane person would do, like a sword being thrusted at them... think about it: would you stay still waiting until it's plunged deep between your ribs, or would you at least try to dodge it? And mind that it's not the first time they're threatened, they won't freeze due to shock.

There is one word in the above explanation that can be annoying: average. I really dislike the idea that the majority is right and am more inclined to believe that the majority is a bunch of selfish idiots unable to comprehend the implications of game theory and suboptimal solutions. Luckily we don't have to refer to the players but can look at the AL. I haven't read the entire thing, but how often does a character use their power in it? To me it looks like the realm is filled with powerful magics but the average player is far from controlling it. Instead magic happens to them, for better or worse. Or we could look at the game mechanics: there are spells to temporarily weaken others, silence them... but no instant kill fireball.


As for people roleplaying demons, werewolves or vampires... some of them would have to think a bit about the MD cosmology. The sun almost never sets and the moon isn't visible often. But what annoys me most is people that say "my character is a demon" and that's it. If I were to say my character is a human, does that define him? If I were to compare character design to sculpting, determining the race is like choosing your block of marble from a quarry. It is an important step, since if you choose a small stone you'll never end up with a big statue, but if you never take up the hammer you'll end up with a block of raw marble...

I think people should be free to choose their race, even if it doesn't occur naturally in MD. When you first start to play this game, you know next to nothing of the realm and it is difficult, almost impossible, to design a character that grew up in this world. The AL does not cover the last century, and one would think that events of less than 100 years ago would still be taught to children growing up inside the realm. This makes it very tempting to have a character that comes from another realm and is (forced to) exploring MD.

The question is "why do people play raw blocks of black demon marble?" I fear the answer is "because demons are powerful." Because if they play a demon they can get away with having powers... Similarly I have noticed some people think that being a higher mp level gives them the right to role play silly powers.


What do I feel about RP at the moment?
1. godmodders are annoying.
2. people should learn the difference between IN and OUT OF CHARACTER.
3. there's way to much OOC. OOC is infectious: you tell something OOC and someone else has a comment on that and then you need to reply again and before you know it the entire chat is filled with OOC. We have all at some point been guilty of this crime sadly.

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Seeing as Magic Duel is an online roleplaying game, I think it's important that people roleplay. An online game without roleplaying is simply mechanics without flavour. It would be battles only, there would be no adventure log, no quests, and every room would be filled with chat about the weather, work, common gossip, and the like.

Does this sound extremely boring to anyone else?

After I explored the mechanics of the game and the fighting for my first five months or so on the game, I gave away and sacrificed all of my creatures. I took a big step towards embracing the game on another level, to interact with people as my character, to be only as my role allowed. And you know something, it is much more fun for me to do that than to run around attacking people, trying different strategies and combat rituals. Every mechanic that is set in stone has a formula for success -- experience and thinking will eventually yield the result that would make you invincible. That, and a lot of time to grind. Or money to buy the tokens. Again, boring.

Roleplaying is the underlying fabric of the game, the interactions between the people is what becomes engrossing, makes me want to come back for more. To make friends and enemies, to share in the things we create for our characters. We each have a role to play, we each have stories to co-create with the other players.

Like Shadow said, it's about us all contributing to the living book that is MD. And I don't blame Z for simply ignoring the preposterous godmodding that he undoubtedly has to suffer through on a weekly basis. Bob has become a living, real part of the game, first through Z's singular dedication, and then through the other players buying into the idea and carrying it on. There are other things like this out there now -- newly seeded trees, for one example -- that add to the nature of the game and invite all participants to experience it.

Our words and actions create a new dimension to the game, one that is overlayed the base mechanics. And it is good roleplaying that creates it, makes it interesting, sustainable, and ultimately enjoyable for all.

That's my 0.02.

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Ha! My favorite subject: role playing :D
You all praised so much RP-ing and cuss fighting that most of the new players TRY (no! they are not even close to succeed) to RP. And an abundance of so many new RP-ers lead to the current situation.Ideas are limited...unfortunately. You really must understand that we, humans, are programmed to win. So they tend to god mode. They want to be the best, they want to win all and they do not consider losing as an option.

If you make an account and the minute after that you decide: I want to be a toe nail then you have 90% chances to fail. You have no idea of what this game is about but YOU HAVE A ROLE! Bs! First you need to play for a while then decide (or who knows...maybe the game will decide for you) what character you want to play (are). I have seen so many new mp3s RP-ing worse then me (and I DON'T RP!).

In short:stop praising RP-ing and then start complaining about the quality of it. If you want quality stop asking for quantity!


@Z:the player that told you that has one role: he is the one that MUST be ignored (I know who he is by your description)

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Well i cant tell if I am a good or bad roleplayer, but for me it seems also, that most people dont play their roles quite good. But a few people do it very good and i am glad they are. To say, some names i really like roles of CrazyMike or DST and Zleiphneir. But I do read more and more "gods" or "demons" with unbeliveable powers.
If I would be a older player I would say "back to the roots" :D

just my two cents!

Nih!

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Alot of people do God mod and in this situation it isnt fun for anyone however I can at times see the usefullness of it (such as when you are doing a planned RP with people who try and interfere whome god mod themselves to try and turn things to they way they want them) In a role play fight or something for example i like to think that the player who is actually stronger has the advantage though this is seen little if at all, I think DST is right when she says no body wants to "lose".. It is hard my character for example is a knight how do you take on a demon vampire something with abundance of rp powers... I have no problem with people making characters like that but they should develop their "powers" as their role or mind power or actual strength develops I believe I read this somewhere on the forum not exact wording but something along the lines that a lvl 1 demon would lose to a lvl 50 peasant/human or something in referance to other games. It is ok to lose heck it can make things more interesting! god mod vs god mod no one wins neither want to do it again do they

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@dst: I haven't noticed any changes in quality nor quantity in the past 200 days. This thread may have appeared recently, the godmodding has existed for a long time.

@sparrhawk: "as their role or mind power or actual strength develops" This statement can be interpreted in many ways, one of them being 'at mind power 4, you get an awesome new option for sparkly blue text, called *I cast pown mp3 nooblet*. imo All characters should have a weakness, and the more special powers you have, the more special weaknesses you should have, be it silver or women (i figure those are the most popular weaknesses atm). If at mp3 you decide your weaknesses are silver and women, and you grind a lot and at when you are finally mp6 some new mp3 comes along and it happens to be a woman in a silver bikini... you're screwed.
"the player who is actually stronger" just try and make a list ranking all players according to their 'strength' in RP fights. Some characters are smart, others are physically strong, or skilled, some have lots of friends... If my character, a human, were to attack one of the werewolves in the realm, trying to use force alone, he'd die in two lines of chat. Obviously he does not do try it. Being slightly paranoid, he would at the very least carry a silver sword, silver chainmail, a stack of silver crossbow bolts and a bag of silver powder. He'd probably be exhausted because of the burden long before entering the lair too.

Not wanting to loose... you should think about that before initiating a RP fight. Obviously someone has got to loose and it is unlikely the other person will want to if you were the one to suddenly initiate a fight. There are no rules about who wins, although I suspect people will consider yielding if the role play was consistent and at least one move was really funny or amazing. Although perhaps we should ask for a new chat function '!roll' to generate a random number; whoever roles higher wins; no retries.

And one more thing that puzzles me: what do you do after you win a RP fight? Do you kill the other one and then resurrect him/her? If you are sparring, there shouldn't be such a reluctance to loose, if you are making it life or death, you will have problems every single time you meet the other person in the future. In general I'm not too fond of RP fights, I prefer games were everybody has fun, not where 50% have to loose and swallow their pride.

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What i meant about who is actually stronger who has the better creatures/stats at your mp level I am sure most people know who they can and who they cannot win against, and most mp3 could not defeat an mp4, or an mp5 most mp4s couldnt beat an mp5 it was the kind of point I was trying to make also. Judging one characters "RP" strenght is not really do able people always come up with more and more "powerful" characters, it would just be a contest of i can do this i can do that in effect god modding also which is why I said the whome is actually stronger could be a good judge to use in role play, people have spells use them in Roleplay anyone can have them that can be the edge you want if you are to fight a higher mind power in a rp fight, im not saying as a rule if an mp4 and an mp5 rp fight that the mp5 has to win by default I am saying they shoudl have the edge the advantage as in game mechanics fighting with creatures they are generally superior. Like my previous statement in other games for example a lvl 1 demon would lose against a lvl 50 human


Reason for edit: havnt had my Coffee yet.. Edited by Sparrhawk

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umm that 50 lvl peasant vs lvl 1 demon... thats quoted from shadow

as for young hot women in silver bikini.... where do i find one?

and as for mp4s mostly be stronger than mp3s :D i disagree if ya mean in quality... (coz there somewhere deep is one mp3 that can beat all mp4s and most of mp5s :blink: ) well if ya mean in quantity... oke but in times when there is less number of mp4s :blink: mp3s kick asses a lot

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[quote name='Liberty4life' date='16 August 2009 - 12:45 AM' timestamp='1250376354' post='39474']
umm that 50 lvl peasant vs lvl 1 demon... thats quoted from shadow
[/quote]

Not taking credit here, because I am certain that in the wide world of roleplay, someone, somewhere, may have said this before I did. I am certain of it; this world is full of godmodding children and adult hobby roleplayers.

http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/4424-children/page__view__findpost__p__35079
http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/4424-children/page__view__findpost__p__35144

Which is basically my opinion this matter. Some of it may not apply, a lot of it will.

How about I add something new.
I wrote this in someone's log, to give you an idea how I handle these people.

[i]"To every action there is an equal and opposed reaction. This game is awesome and great and so it is only natural that annoying people show up."[/i]

You have some choices when dealing with these godmodders or immature roleplayers, or whatever you want to call them.
I use a... in my opinion, a more mature and relaxed perspective on these matters. I ignore them or simply roleplay an action that makes them look immature or foolish.

For instance if someone roleplays eating me, I respond by either ignoring them or by roleplaying that s/he should let me go, if s/he favors his/her teeth.
If someone roleplays like in the first example; a giant blob eating bob and spitting it out. I would respond by either ignoring it or more likely: roleplaying that I see a quite delusional person humping bob the tree and licking it awkwardly. I then roleplay wondering where one could find a narcotic that would make one so delusional.

Continuous complaining about people who cannot roleplay properly to the already set consensus of the older players, well, that is just basically useless. If these people are indeed so immature or not used to the level of roleplay, then they will probably not read the forum.
In the offchance they do adjust, then it was a great thing indeed.

But far better it is to adapt. Because these people will never stop coming and if you allow them to ruin the game for you, you let them win.

Instead, keep roleplaying accordingly and set the good example or standard. Passive action, such as NOT RECOMMENDING THEM FOR PWR OR RPC, would be far more efficient in my opinion. These people will always come and play in such a manner, but if you can hold a more prestigious place over them and set a better example, then I believe that in the end, when the grows and grows, the majority of the players will have followed the example and the new players who godmod, will find themselves to be regarded as delusional and in the minority.

Sounds a bit rough what I am implying, peer pressuring them into /more liked behaviour/, but that is the world we live in. But remember, I am an emperor, I am not a goodly and kind man who wants to be liked by all.

Complaining does not help a lot I believe, but should it help, by all means, go ahead. Better you than me. I just think it is better to just ignore them or to ridicule them. Oh and to not recommend them for, well, basically anything.

To stay on topic here, I believe that the current RP is actually quite good. I had expected a lot more Ledah's and the like. You see glass half empty, I see half a glass of vodka in my belly and half more to go before I drunkenly make a pass at some random female relative of yours and make merry while embarassing not only me, but her in front of your entire family as well, with the added result that you can no longer look at her with straight eyes and thoughts. Ever. Edited by Metal Bunny

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((This is one of my favorite topics. I will break my own tradition here and speak entirely out-of-character.

Roleplay is as much about what a character canNOT do as what she can do. A character's concept is defined by the player's imagination, but should also be informed by the setting. In most RPGs, the setting is explicit and very narrowly defined - very few people play D&D or World of Warcraft expecting to portray Wild West gunslingers or 20th Century Mafia dons. Because MagicDuel does not force the matter on players, we see a very wide variety of characters in the game.

That's fine. It might even be good, if we were to develop a meta-plot about how the realm of MagicDuel entraps entities from other worlds. But all players should understand something: [u]if your character had powers in the world where you conceived him, he almost certainly no longer has them in MagicDuel[/u]. This is not a blow to the character, but an opportunity for character growth, a chance to demonstrate roleplaying skill. Do you fancy yourself a good roleplayer? Good. You're normal. Play that role and make it convincing. Look at LunarGoddess - here's a deity who has lost her power. Here's an immortal who has fallen in love with a mortal man. She has a story to tell.

I run a lot of tabletop roleplaying campaigns. If you sat down at one of my D&D games and told me that your character is a half-demon with spell-like abilities, I'd laugh in your face. Why? Because the game includes rules for those kinds of things, and you can't just declare that you want them. If you can have them at all, such as the demonic heritage, the spell-like abilities will come gradually. When everyone is a super bad-ass, the game is BORING. What is interesting? Uncertainty; bluffing an entity you are sure can kill you; holding your breath as the GM rolls the dice, knowing the result could mean the difference between life and death for a beloved character.

Don't bore us with magical powers you assigned your character. We have no reason to believe in them, because the game has a system for magical powers. Those who have magical powers worked hard to get them. Don't tell us about your awesome gear or unstoppable fighting ability: the game has a fighting system and gear. If you are a super bad-ass fighter, word will get around.

Roleplay fighting almost invariably fails because it has no system of governance. It is therefore my opinion, after months of experimentation, that it has no place in MagicDuel. Sparrhawk makes an excellent point: if you're just sparring, you should be willing to take a beating now and again. If you're only going to win every fight, you will be boring... and you will end up being ignored by people who are actually using the system to fight with each other. The very idea! :P

Outlandish roleplay almost invariably fails because it sets too few (or no) limitations on itself. For every Innocence, a really brilliant character with amazing inventiveness that has nothing to do with combat, role-played or otherwise, there are twenty demon-heritage warriors with elemental magic that has no in-game effect whatsoever.

If you are a roleplayer, [i]do not ignore the system[/i]. Use its limitations as a springboard for your creativity. Have you noticed that no one bleeds in MagicDuel? That the sun never sets? That stacks of gold magically replenish themselves over time?

How will you explain these things? What will they mean to your character? What will your story be in this world?

We are waiting to be entertained. Some of us are ready to entertain you, too.))

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I kind of think of helping the newbies out at the very beginning of their entrance to the world, I personally believe, if you introduce them to RP at their early age, tell them a few stories about some story, help orientate them to the World of MD, don't bias them to lean to any one side, teach them the very few rules of this great game, essentially, be a mentor.

It gives them a much easier start, a better understanding of what goes on in the world, and helps ensure that MD will have a fresh batch of good people that will make the game more interesting.

Don't see this happening soon, but I like to give thanks to all of the live help and veterans that dedicate their time to helping new people out.

of course there is my personal pet peeve of idiots that use abbreviations of English words, furthering the language being butchered into just bizarre things.... Cheers!

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Yay RP topic!!!

I think one of the main thins is, like shadow and others said, realize your age in game. Also realize that PRINCIPLES should affect how you RP. Say a 15 days old darkness character cobats a 200 days old darkness character. 15 day old has 50 darkness principle, and 200 day old has 400. When the younger character taunts the older character, and the older character attacks it should land. It should not "pass through the younger character unaffected". I think alot of people forget about principles when they rp. I don't know about others, but I feel you should pick principles that your character represents. If you picked light and entropy, act accordinly. If you picked darkness and imagination....you should not be a good knight helping all others at the drop of a hat. Should be chaotic and help others only to futher your own ends.

Also I really dislike when people react for you with their rp. You should not "stab my sword into your throat". It should be "Stabs my sword twards your throat". Give people reaction. Unless of course the RP has been worked out via YIM or some other form of OOC to where its ok "like when me and sage rp we make reactions for each other".....I know it's a frustrating thing to do because like other said noone wants to lose. To me you prove yourself MUCH MORE OF AN RPER when you do lose. We all are not perfect and there is always someone bigger and badder out there

so remember...if your an infant you can not kick a grown warriors arse UNLESS HE WANTS YOU TO, and be willing to lose once and a while....even to a weaker character....

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lol nice mention but... thing is principals dont have alignment, nothing in magic has alignment, so this cant decide if char is good evil chaotic lawful or wot ever, however it can have a SLIGHT effect on chars profession, for example dreamer without imagination sounds ridiculous :D no?

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[quote name='Liberty4life' date='16 August 2009 - 11:09 AM' timestamp='1250435343' post='39601']
lol nice mention but... thing is principals dont have alignment, nothing in magic has alignment, so this cant decide if char is good evil chaotic lawful or wot ever, however it can have a SLIGHT effect on chars profession, for example dreamer without imagination sounds ridiculous :) no?
[/quote]


You mean to say that in general thought darkness is not considered evil?
light is not considered good?
balance is not considered chaotic?

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You can use light for example, to blind a little girl and steal her candies, or use darkness to hide some of the innocent peasants from evil knights.

On topic..

I see many... strange things but I try not to care about them. Edited by Shantu

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I hear things like people don't eat or bleed a fair amount, but there is a lot of blood in this game, in the AL, and food is occasionally mentioned. The AL seems to treat people as physical beings, not some floaty spiritual beings. It'd be awful boring if we all were.

As for fighting, it doesn't really work out too well unless it's based off of the built in system, or if everyone involved is willing to cooperate. Of course a person has to realize that numbers are HUGELY important. Sure, Sparrhawk could beat well over half the people in the game, but were it possible for four people to attack him at once, (in game mechanics) most any four who know anything about the battle system could beat him. (Think about fighting a ritual with 20 birds in it.)

One thing I like, is creativity. If a person can explain HOW he does what he does, it lends a great deal more credence in my eyes, though having an in game spell lends a great deal more credence. I would like it if more those who have in game spells tried to explain them a bit too. Also, age and reputation is a big deal. Guybrush is a doctor, he fights, but as far as role goes, I'm ok with a great many people in the realm being able to beat him. He's a doctor for goodness sake, but he is dabbling in magic. Slowly he is developing himself in the principals, and talking to those respected in the areas before continuing. When I actually get a heal spell (or if), I'll have had months of back story on how he developed the ability.

As for a complex plot, both sides need to be in OOC communication. I am a doctor, if someone inflicts someone with a disease of some sort, I need to know what I'll find. If I say minituarized drachorns are swimming around inside of him cooking his internal organs when the person actually just gave him the flu, things start losing coherence. For good RP, you need to be in communication with your characters enemy, out of character.

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The one thing I didn't see mentioned here is Free Will. Unfortunately, Free Will makes everyone do things he usually wouldn't do until someone comes along and shows him that anyone can.

Now before anyone becomes sarcastic, I am speaking of puns and not really being specific about Free Will (whomever he/she is). Puns in role playing makes for hilarious reading only for those who have been playing the game long enough to know who those characters are. The use of names for example; dst, everyone, Peace and Mur help me, Bob, can cause symptoms of PML, ROFLing if used in the right context. Let me pick on Dst here for a moment and let poor everyone have some Peace. When one battles with Dst and gets their Army wiped out, the saying "I've been Dst." become a pun. If there is another term for it, I am sure I will be corrected immediately if not ASAP.

Game terms is another way to use puns in role playing. To list a few; brisk, heat, regenerate, and the most used one, Dead Girl. Using the Blue chat, one might type thus: Sagewoman: *watches Dead Girl walk by Briskly, her face Heated, trying to Regenerate some composure*.

So, what am I getting at here? The use of Humor in role playing. As most know, Windy (proprietor and owner of the Wind and Rain Pub in Winds Sanctuary) and I use puns all the time in our role play. We shamelessly use character names and game terms that are guaranteed to make inhabitants to use the slang, LOL, ROFL, and my personal favorite, PIMP in the chat.

Like Godmoddling, not everyone likes it, approves of it, but Mur Help Me (another pun)it's Liberating to let some of the frustration and Real Real anxieties out!

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I don't see what all the fuss is about...
ofcourse, having a population that consists lagely of half-demons is not right, but let them be
some change their roles later, others don't

the people who want to RP seriously can still do it, and besides
on the chat very nearly nobody impersonates his/her character
most of the talks go about cookies/muffins, fights etc

so i don't mind if someone is half-demon, half-vampire, it just stops me from reading the personal papers :D

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ahmmm...
seems you have yet failed to notice how deep stories the real roles have...

of course the muffin-man will give out muffins when he's in the mood, the dark side has cookies, the fighters talk about fight...

if you find a demon talking about hell, you consider it RP, too, so why not have some SERIOUSLY GOOD RP about muffins with Firs?
or learn from a combat-pro? or join the dark side to get a free cookie?

i'd consider most conversations about music, politics, astro-physics and such OOC, but even those issues are coverd by some chars in MD, just think of Bootes, the Celestial Observer... (unfortunately, i'm growing old... 80% of all people wouldn't even know who the Ninjunny or Acid-Hitler are...)

idk what to say on the topic, since all the good points were already made...

what i'd like to add though: no matter how crappy the idea of a role is, be it vampire, demon, pyromancer, elemental wizard, whatever, and no matter how overpowerd they are *cough*godmodders-with-even-knowing*cough*, one can make a good role out of it if they get their chance....

however, if you take your chance and waste it, don't come crying about not being respected as what you are... i don't respect anybody who claims to heal in 5 seconds after my Grasan crushed him, unless he has either hundreds of regen or thousands of power -.-

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