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Announcement 3170

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Btw, the announcement made by the Council was pretty smart.

Yes, I too am waiting for the outcome of this.

 

Considering that DD actually shit on Council by going over it by asking Mur for help (that's my understanding from this topic) and actively shows his disrespect toward Council and authority ... and now DD is asking ... no demanding help from Council .

The answer from Council will be interesting.

 

I have tried to, and still do, to give second changes to others but DD is testing the limits and he is showing some lack of judgment.

 

And DD ... if you want something done ... you have the "trial" way. Why do you ask others to do your job and deciding ? Do go ahead and sue Dst. (yeah :P , it is a dare)

 

 

Edit:

By the way,  I forgot this : It seems that Eon sent the ppl ONCE to gazebo (22:19) then nothing until 22:48 but in the mean time he was provoked by Rophs (22:21). Oh well, somebody should have not done that .

Edited by No one

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Edit:

By the way,  I forgot this : It seems that Eon sent the ppl ONCE to gazebo (22:19) then nothing until 22:48 but in the mean time he was provoked by Rophs (22:21). Oh well, somebody should have not done that .

 

There would be little point of sending everyone back again too soon. It simply took that long for most players to get back on track, or at least past the MDA gates again.

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To clarify, some examples:

I. Got a knife? Feel free to stab someone in the back. The only consequences you have to worry about are what other players do in return. Upset about being dead? Find a way to get revived. And better yet, get revenge. Or maybe you just want justice? Get your land leader to pass laws regarding killings and use land funds to secure means to enforce these laws.  Seek treaties with other lands and groups to strengthen these deterrents. 
 
II. Want to prevent resource depletion. Post an armed guard. 
 
III. Afraid someone's gonna mess with your quest? Silvertongue them repeatedly for the duration. Or pay someone else to distract them. Or hold a signup for your event in advance, so you can message the participants the start time privately and hold the event in secret. Or plan the event for when they're usually offline.
 
If you start to bifurcate the realm based upon the idea that interference is bad, then we might as well all have an instance of MD to ourselves. And that would be lame. A singleplayer PvP, wat?

Addendums:
 
I. I'm afraid my examples aren't too great, but you've got me riled.
II. I think the divide here might be differences of thought about roleplaying. I consider myself a roleplayer, but I rely upon ideas and mechanics, rather than make believe. You should too. It would make me happy.

 
Indeed your examples are bad.  Every one of them require you to be defensive from attack.  While I agree a certain amount of evil is good, evil that has more power then anyone else is bad. The whole Mya thing was a PRIME example of what "DST and crew" does.  DST hates mya, and because of that she ruined their RP.  Why?  Because, DST thought the RP was bad in her own opinion.  Looks like the same with DD, just because they don't like DD, Eon interrupted a quest.  Should we go back through old posts to see the people who left because of DST and crew?  
 
I believe totally that evil and good should both exist and have, for the most part, freedom of choice.  However MANY people look at this game and see things upside down.  DST a Judge?  Last I checked in R/L judges were supposed to be the MOST upstanding of citizens and protecting their rights.  Rights to have RP of their choosing, or peaceful quests without someone "breaking" it.  If this was a quest to plot war, or something aggressive, than I would understand more.  DST used to be fun and deserved the awards she was given.  Now she is just hateful twards others and does everything she can to disrupt the realm as a whole.
 
DST and Eon combined have most of the killing and life tools, and also many spells and gold to fund their harrassment. Depleting their area of its resources so only they can have them, ruining any RP they deem "not worthy".  Flat out harassing people until they feel enough frustration to leave the game.  Yes a game...something that shouldn't cause so much stress to ones person that they flip out and leave.
 
I personally feel this has been going on for some time.  I feel sorry that they only feel good about themselves when they are being cruel to others.  That does not however warrant complete disregard for others feelings in order to make themselves feel better.  I do not, and can not believe that the "powers that be" have been completely ignorant to the events that have taken place over the past year or so. An example is when Mya was dead, some players came and asked me to kill DST.  Would I have? Of course not, because I believe that killing items should be used only as a last resort.  Instead of asking or talking to me when she found out, DST came and threatened me that :
 
"So...I heard you have been contacted to kill me. :D That's nice.

But just a friendly advice: if you kill me, I will be revived in the very few minutes after I realize that I am dead (2 - TWO reviving items are at my disposal) and then I am going to use my fang on you.

Think twice or even three times before you attempt something against me.

Oh and the above includes also Eon and No one."
and
 
"As you wish phantasm. Just don't say i didn't warn you.
Raise just one finger against me or No one or Eon (ha! especially Eon) and all you'll see is necro's graveyard."
 
So she says here "Its ok I kill people, but if people try an take retribution against me being a murderer, I'll ruin your game for you."  Thats what I heard anyways.  This is all very sad, because DST used to be alot of fun being evil.  I think she was given so much free power, that she now assumes she does not have to answer for anything.  Maybe she doesn't.  If so then I assure you this game will not last.  The "sandlot" (DST and crew) claim how much activity they have caused in the last couple months with their works.  From what I have seen their defense and reply is that they are "helping" the realm by making trouble so people want to do something.  Perhaps if the sandlot would have let people have their "crappy RP" or their "crappy Quests" there would be more activity in the realm.
 
I do agree DD complains a bit here and there, and tends to be on shaky ground with his explanations.  However at least DD is trying to do something for the community, and not against it.  I'm not DD's friend, and do not know him that well.  I do know that ANYONE who tries to do something for the community, should be allowed to do.

Edited by Burns

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There would be little point of sending everyone back again too soon. It simply took that long for most players to get back on track, or at least past the MDA gates again.

 

Yes, I admit it , it might be that reason, but what I wanted to say is that it is a bad idea to startle Eon.

 

 

 

 

This below is just as offtopic as Phantasm's . So ... if his post will be moved, please move this one too.

------------------------

[spoiler]

 


"So...I heard you have been contacted to kill me. :D That's nice.

But just a friendly advice: if you kill me, I will be revived in the very few minutes after I realize that I am dead (2 - TWO reviving items are at my disposal) and then I am going to use my fang on you.

Think twice or even three times before you attempt something against me.

Oh and the above includes also Eon and No one."

and

 

"As you wish phantasm. Just don't say i didn't warn you.
Raise just one finger against me or No one or Eon (ha! especially Eon) and all you'll see is necro's graveyard."

 

So she says here "Its ok I kill people, but if people try an take retribution against me being a murderer, I'll ruin your game for you."  Thats what I heard anyways.  This is all very sad, because DST used to be alot of fun being evil.  I think she was given so much free power, that she now assumes she does not have to answer for anything. 

[/spoiler]

As I understood from previous post ... this is called "solve issues on a social way" and as I understand she did solved it.

And yes, some stick to their friends.

 

 

 

 I think she was given so much free power,

 

 

Now ... you are really exaggerating ... or you just play the "me idiot". 

Please explain your statement.  Unless you tell exactly what was given for free without being earned then it is called a calumny and Dst is entitled to ask for certain measures especially since you have a history in vilifying her ( yeah and me and Eon).

 

 

 

I do agree DD complains a bit here and there, and tends to be on shaky ground with his explanations.  However at least DD is trying to do something for the community, and not against it.  I'm not DD's friend, and do not know him that well.  I do know that ANYONE who tries to do something for the community, should be allowed to do.

 

And again you are wrong. What he does is not for community but for himself (please read this among other things on the forum). Also, by the way he acts / acted on forum, he himself said he doesn't care about what others think.

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I accidentally neg repped Chewy's post. I meant to pos rep it

@DD and dst: I didnt say YOU were a whiner, DD, nor did I say YOU abused anything, dst. I pointed out those were YOUR  accusations to eachother.
 
Btw, DD, this is unclear: you are saying that the council put up the ann w/o you sending them an email or smtg? Because you also say [font='comic sans ms', cursive]It took much convincing to make the announcement, The Rich Merchant.[/font]


I had an email conversation with Council regarding the quest in which it took convincing, before the quest, to do something to safeguard quests, eg make an announcement.

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I had an email conversation with Council regarding the quest in which it took convincing, before the quest, to do something to safeguard quests, eg make an announcement.

We have received a complaint from a player that their quest was recently disrupted

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And again you are wrong. What he does is not for community but for himself (please read this among other things on the forum). Also, by the way he acts / acted on forum, he himself said he doesn't care about what others think.


Like many people in the past, I decided to have another shot at it even after being hurt. I'm about to include you in the scandal report as well.

Your (THIS) post is exactly the reason I sometimes think the community doesn't deserve the time I invest to make a quest, but I'll do it anyway.

I indeed don't care about what MOST people think, and you're one of them. But that doesn't stop me from putting away personal issues to do something for the game I love.

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By "free power" I mean free will to do without reprocusions.  You should know better then most No One, that everything in MD is given based on merit.  I made no claim that her spells, gold, role and such were not given/rewarded justly.  DST at one time did soo much for the realm.  Nobody argues that, we can go back into YEARS ago and see many things.  DST USED to be a great player in the game, and this in no way describes my feelings about the player, just the character.  Her character has become a terrorist.  If thats the role she wishes to play its of her own choosing. 

 

The Free Power she is given, is lax in "powers that be" to do anything about several past cited issues that the community brought up.  This sure isn't the first time that more then a couple people make a statement against what DST is doing.  Some people claimed it was because "DST is Mur's friend so he won't do anything", as Im sure most of us remember.  I am not saying that is correct, in fact I think its just a scape-goat.  However the lack of any reprocussions for their actions against more then a few people have left alot of the community wondering where any justice is in this game.  If there is non, then that is the decision of the "powers that be".  If so, then this game has truly become something other then what it was when a grand game.  I have so many wonderful memories of the game and friends.  I have wonderful memories of good times with DST.  Her and I were not always at odds, and in fact used to have a good time at Tree.  At least I remember it that way.

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[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]We have received a complaint from a player that their quest was recently disrupted[/size][/font]


Stop trying to twist meanings.

Talking to council about something bad being done to me would be called a complaint.

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@ Phantasm: Ok

 

 

I had an email conversation with Council regarding the quest in which it took convincing, before the quest, to do something to safeguard quests, eg make an announcement.

That is an interesting request, considering you don't give a shit on what the Council represents. (see my above posts about that)

So, what did they reply on your "email" on which the Council needed convincing ?

 

So, you actually made a false quest just to prove your point and then, when you received what you asked for, you quit the quest ? Is that what you say ?

 

And ... did you do the complaint ... before or after the quest ?

 

 

Anyway, even if I'll tell you to read my posts from before this ... "false quest" , you wouldn't nor you would try to understand my point. So I will not bother much anymore. You just don't want to read. Your loss (as I said so many times before).

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On the one hand, I am glad to see people debating and indeed, valid points are raised by both sides. Nevertheless, I'll try to summarise my opinion so far in (hopefully) something that people will agree with so that we can reach a consensus about this.

 

1. DD running the quest for his own interest: 

I cannot objectively judge this, and I don't think anyone can. Besides, -everyone- will have some kind of interest when running a quest; I don't think anyone will do something like this without motivation, regardless what that is. I don't see something inherently wrong with it.

 

2. DD not planning to "defend" his quest better:

I personally think this is icky - on the one hand I believe that some measures should be taken, but IMO when faced with Eon, Dst (and perhaps SoS as a whole) it is rather overwhelming to think about what you can do to defend yourself. I don't wish to take sides on this one, but my opinion would be: plan some sort of defense mechanism, but I don't think it's ok for you to need Mur-scaled artillery to protect your quest. So... evil guys, please don't overdo your part (as lame as that sounds, I can't find better words for it at the moment.)

 

3. Eon's actions:

I don't see them as inherently wrong, even though perhaps it came across as such from my previous posts. I don't want it to look like I'm trying to say that what Eon (&company) is doing is wrong. Annoying? Yes. But not inherently wrong. I don't think it's in anyone's jurisdiction to dictate how a player uses an item/spell, as long as it's not abusive and/or used for harassment. Who should judge abuse/harassment? I believe the Council. Again, do not get me wrong. I don't think what Eon did was abuse or harassment. It was a bit of a nuisance (I think more for the quest participants rather than for DD, but again, I cannot judge that).

 

4. Council (and my main point from the beginning):

I still believe the council's motivation was weak. I will try and quote fragments from the announcement to be more specific:

 

(referring to quest disruption): "we are loathed to make any form of rules to punish people doing this". The way I read this is "we don't want to be disliked by the community for stepping up for something". I think this makes the Council look really weak, as if they're afraid of the public opinion. Sometimes, they might have to take decisions that are disliked. It's not always going to be pretty - how can we be sure the Council does the right thing and doesn't just choose the easiest path?

 

"At this time, we merely ask you try not disrupting quests" + "A social problem can only be solved socially." So in one line they say "at this time", implying there could be more drastic decision if the problem persists, but in the end they say the problem can only be solved socially. Which one is it? I am not inclined towards either, but please make up your mind and be clear. You're the Council, your words shouldn't be interpretable, the way I see it. If you're going to act, be firm about it, if you're not going to, say that this is out of the Council's hands and that it's on the community's shoulders. 

 

I believe that sums it up. To reiterate, I opened this topic mostly to complain about the Council. Not about DD's quest, not about Eon's interference. Again, my issue here is with the way the Council seems to deal with things; it seems to be weak, and IMO in Mur's absence, the Council really should be strong or at least uphold such an image. 

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Several points to be made:

 

 

I LOVE phantasm's post. He hates Eon and No one because they took over SoS and invest a lot more time and brain into gathering/using resources. He sees them as a threat to the East.phantasm would love to be the only one pulling the strings in the East.

 

He doesn't like me (despite his bla bla) and hates the fact that I used MY SOCIAL GAME to stop him from killing me. To be honest, I didn't think it would work. I was quite surprised he didn't do it (aka kill me). This means he's a lot more scared than he wishes to admit. Seems I am a really powerful social player :D :D (the irony :P).

 

Also, I don't like being called a terrorist. That is plain wrong and VERY insulting. You, phantasm, as an American you should know what terrorism is. Comparing me and Eon to terrorists just shows how colorblind and ignorant you are.

 

What none of you get it is the fact that I used only powers given to me during the first years so no, there is no abuse there. There are spells I have for years and with a lot less casts now than I used to have. The killing item is not even mine.

 

 

So, DD went to council to ask for safeguarding. He didn't get anything (or...he got the Ann after beg *cough* asking several times the council). He runs quest. Quest is disrupted. DD stops quest cause point was made. DD goes back to Council to ask for his "reward". DD happy that the ANN was posted and yells that he did it for the community.

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Closed, why? Becuase this is just going in circles and I like to silence free thinking.

There are two issues here. A) DD's quest being disrupted, and B) a more general problem of a society and authority that allows this. I shall be making topics about both soon.

The first, is much more easily solved. The second, I encourage everyone to _think_ about this. Then in a couple days I will make a new forum topic or maybe even have an ingame discussion.
----

No, The first needs to be dealt with DD however he wants.

The second, I will be making a topic about later.

If you want to make a topic to discuss, Make it general, otherwise just have a think and we will discuss it when some things have cooled down.

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