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Nimrodel

In the eye of the beholder - quest results

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First of all thank you very much for waiting patiently for the results. My apologies for making you awesome folks wait for so long.

I am enclosing the score cards as given by the individual judges and the final score card, along with the guidelines I gave them for scoring.

The links to the entries are:
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDSEhBUzEwUmxqRE0/edit?usp=sharing"]1.Apple[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1J3G60_2ZE5deBNoORjhcsyA8-vs8k6e32eCGGzVPVjE/edit?usp=sharing"]2.Banana[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDY2tlcDdLMmJtWWs/edit?usp=sharing"]3.Custard Apple[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDLWFlZVEtekwtSk0/edit?usp=sharing"]4. Dates[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDWXd0MHVieEFZNWc/edit?usp=sharing"]5. Elderberry[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDWVFHSTRMWk1VSFU/edit?usp=sharing"]6. Fig[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDc0RkRFZEVG5ZZ0k/edit?usp=sharing"]7.Grape[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ie74Km0rEOWM2-I1sGP2iMTZ84P6I8N9dWzJo7uT4C4/edit?usp=sharing"]8.Hazelnut[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDVWtRYVVKSWNkSkE/edit?usp=sharing"]9.Indian Cherry[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDT3ZUNlhoRklUbXc/edit?usp=sharing"]10. Jackfruit[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDVUJ6amNWaWJoTEE/edit?usp=sharing"]11.Kumquat[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDWUx5a2xQV2liQ0E/edit?usp=sharing"]12. Lychee[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDSFN1dHBrYTBqSzA/edit?usp=sharing"]13.Mango[/url]

Here is the link to the guidelines for scoring: [url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDT3BaZHRUV2pETG8/edit?usp=sharing"] Scoring Guidelines[/url]

Here is the detailed spreadsheet of scores:
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDTEE3TDBnb05zdVU/edit?usp=sharing"]Judge 1[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDVzlMYUJlMnNabUE/edit?usp=sharing"]Judge 2[/url]
[url="https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B8yg7kTKVqvDLTY3Mkg4Qk9DTTQ/edit?usp=sharing"]Final score card[/url]

Winners:
First place: Hazelnut
Second place: Elderberry
Third place: Kumquat
Fourth place: Apple
Fifth place: Custard Apple

Special reward: Banana

CONGRATULATIONS!!! :)


Now, I ask you all a favour. PLease give me some feedback using this feedback form: [url="https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1818iWPw9MCF0hKoVxH4D_c9Zhe-cLTE6JRwpYRMhPzI/edit?usp=sharing"] Feedback form[/url]


Thank you very much for participating in the quest. Your rewards will get to you shortly :)

Edit: Minor clarification: There were meant to be three judges initially, but one judge had some real life issues and didnt have the time needed to give each entry the attention it deserved. Hence only two judges.

Edited by Nimrodel

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Giving 2 silver coins to everybody who didnt place in the quest. PLease see me at howling gates today evening at 7.30pm Server Time.
[s]Amberrune[/s]
[s]Valldore Nal[/s]
[s]darkraptor[/s]
[s]Dark demon[/s]
[s]Change[/s]
Shadowseeker
[s]Princ Rhaegar[/s] Edited by Nimrodel

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What is the reason for not revealing judges and actual order of the winners? I don't see a reason for this and the only ideas I have suggest ulterior and perverse motives in respect to fairness. I hope you can clarify the reasoning.

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It may lead to disagreement between people. One person may not agree with the other person's point of view. It better if things aren't direct. Also, if someone comments negatively about an entry, people who wrote the entry might feel embarassed if it is revealed who wrote what.

Since the entries are public, I'm sure everyone recognises their own entries. If the prizes were given away to the wrong person I'm sure there would surely be a hue and cry about it. If you really want to know who won what, I suggest you go find the details in the logs or ask someone to get the details for you.

As for the judges, the names of both the judges are pretty clear from the score cards. Nothing about them is hidden. you just need to know where to look. Edited by Nimrodel

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[quote name='Nimrodel' timestamp='1365263397' post='134679']
It may lead to disagreement between people. One person may not agree with the other person's point of view. It better if things aren't direct. Also, if someone comments negatively about an entry, people who wrote the entry might feel embarassed if it is revealed who wrote what.
[/quote]

Doesn't have much sense to me - if a participant is unsatisfied with the results, and the judges are already known (Burns and Kyphis as your judge score links say), they can already channel their newfound hatred :))
We know who the winners are, now, so why not say who was 1st place, and who was 5th?

If someone comments negative about a winning entry, person may get embarrassed? What about the loser list you posted? That's not embarrassing?

I personally am largely dissatisfied with how the judges rated certain works, but won't go into it, there's really no point. I would like to know who wrote what, so I could appreciate the player more, and perhaps understand his/her work better by the fact that I already know that participant from before, being easier for me to interpret what was meant by certain lines.

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I did not post a loser list. If you think you lost without gaining anything by submitting stuff in that quest, that you didnt learn anything new, ONLY THEN you have lost.

Also, i didnt post which post belonged to whom. I just posted a list of players who didnt get placed. In a random order. thats what I did with the winners. As I said, If you are that curious about who won which place, you can check the creature logs. I am sure everything will be clear. or you can ask the players personally which place they won.

Also, you should check the scoring guidelines before commenting on how the judges gave you scores.

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I find your explanation a bit naive. Of course it's a "loser" list. Yes, my label 'loser' may be a bit off, but it's the essence of it. When you have 13 people, of which 6 won something and 7 received consolation rewards for participating, that usually means that those 7 failed to meet judge standards. Lost the competition/contest - henceforth the loser list, contest wise.

If you wanted to preserve the privacy of participants, you should have kept all the names away from public eyes.
If the names are easily trackable, as they are and as you say, then there's no real point hiding (partly) names of the participants.

And I did read your scoring guidelines, what makes you say I didn't?

Anyhows - I'm not trying to put you or your quest down. The quest was a good idea, I'm glad it had this much participants and attention from the community, although I am discontent about certain things in the organization which I expressed. I'm basically now just replying on your challenge of my dissatisfaction. I have a feeling that you think we don't have the right to criticize, or that our critic is without base. Edited by Rhaegar Targaryen

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[quote name='Nimrodel' timestamp='1365263397' post='134679']
As for the judges, the names of both the judges are pretty clear from the score cards. Nothing about them is hidden. you just need to know where to look.
[/quote]

Then i didnt see why you bothered to hide then and not state them? i couldnt access the google docs on my phone and therefore would have appareciated it if you explicitly named them. Thank you Rheagar for doing this so that i may know who it was.

To me it just doesnt make sense to not tell the order of the winner and tell me to go find the logs. It seems a waste of my time to do this and then post the results when you could just post them,.

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@rhaegar: The whole point of giving a quest feedback form is so that i can get info on how to improve my quests. did you fill it?

@ chewett: I will not post the list according to the positions. You can go check in the logs or ask the individual players. You can yourself post the list here if you want. Or the winners can come forward stating as to which entry is theirs. I will not do it.

As for judges, since you cannot log on to a pc, (weird though that bugs@magicduel.com cannot log onto a pc or wait till he gets his hands on one) The judges are Burns and Kyphis.

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I am aware of the quest feedback form and its purpose.

Since you don't wish to discuss, I'll withdraw from the topic - I can't see why, because the very nature of your quest was comparison of our perceptions, to improve understanding about our realm globally, reward the finest thoughts. Isn't dialogue in accordance to those principles and goals? When you have two opposed opinions, the result may be very enlightening, and you are shunning this wonderful possibility.

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[quote name='Nimrodel' timestamp='1365266600' post='134686']
As for judges, since you cannot log on to a pc, (weird though that bugs@magicduel.com cannot log onto a pc or wait till he gets his hands on one) The judges are Burns and Kyphis.
[/quote]

I have family, i got visit them, i travel, surprisingly i have a life. [many rude words removed] Edited by Chewett

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I can't speak for others but I will reveal my entry (although lots of people already know it).
My entry was coded as hazelnut.

Also if you would have read careful the entries, another one of the winners would have been revealed since he gave away his identity in the first few sentences.

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I dont mind revealing my name either. My entry was coded as banana. I also dont think that special secrecy is needed here. Imagine olympic games, where the names of the winners would be kept in secret - I think its quite a disappointment for both participants and for public. Moreover, I am sure - each of us, who participated is proud of what we have written and done, because it took time and effort if not to say an intense work of the brain cells. And Nim - thanks for the quest.

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I'm Jackfruit, as can be seen if you look at my entry. ;) I'm somewhat ashamed of it. I didn't properly allocate nearly enough time for it, and it's such an awesome quest idea! What's done is done though, and I'd always love talking to anyone about what things mean in MD.

My thanks to Nimrodel, all three judges for deciding to take on the crazy amount of text, the sponsors, and to all the other fruits who submitted something along with me. Also, I knew that the Fusioneers symbol looked like a bloody, dead, mutant fish!

Edited by Change

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I am "custard apple", which is an actual item apparently.The things you learn..

Well thats one thing extra I learned from this quest.Im glad i devoted JUST enough time to my entry, though I havd no idea how I couldve devoted any less time..

I liked the topic of the quest, and the managment mightve had its downs but I enjoyed looking at the icons of logos I have seen for years and think about them in a new light.In that sense, atleast, this quest was fun for me.

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Kumquat here.

The most fun part of this sort of analysis, for me, comes in responding to others' perspectives. Hopefully you're not all so exhausted from the writing that you wouldn't be up to discussion yourselves..

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My entry was the one under Lychee (which by the way i had no idea what fruit it is :P ) Thank you Nim for the quest, i really liked the idea and enjoyed writing the submission (and once i have a little bit of time, i'm sure i'm gonna enjoy reading all the others as well :D) And congrats to the winners :)

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[font=comic sans ms,cursive][color=#006400]Fig :D[/color][/font]

[font=comic sans ms,cursive][color=#006400]Congratz to the winners and special thanks to Nim for the idea of this quest. Not only did I learn from this, but also became an MD Wiki editor :)[/color][/font]

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