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no. soubtle differences, a lot more power to the meaning, more elaborated and less clean than the "snake thing". notice the 8+1 (you see it?, what about blue and black? not colors, or the connection between 3&4), anyway a lot more i can say, this is a masterpiece at symbol level and i am not shy to brag about it.

The problem is that the meaning of the M&T, even if they fit both with Tribunal and Mur and with my name initials, they are not letters.
The lines have an other meaning, one that is so powerful that i am sure this symbol was used before, probably in religious context. Therefore, i will start a challange..offering a nice reward for whoever finds the MT combined in exactly this way somehwere else. Don't worry about the wings and such, the angles come from Egypt :D

i think i will tattoo this one :))

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After conducting some interesting research into the Land Logo, I have come to the following conclusions:

The "MT" symbol is the resulting morphing of the old pharmacology sign meaning [i]blend/mix[/i]. (Suiting for this symbol to appear after Mur's introduction of the Cauldron.)

The differentiation( 5 spheres at the end of each straight line, and the additional line resulting in the T) from the "MT" symbol could stand for the completion of the mixture. (I am probably stretching here...) Mur has been looking for the correct mixture of Lands, and with the addition of the Tribunal, that might mean the completion of the Blend.

The two "dragons" along the sides of the sphere are simply the incorporation of Mur's self professed "favourite" symbol... the MagicDuel symbol. It can be seen here:

[center][IMG]http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/3236/birdblank.jpg[/IMG][/center]

The incorporation of the two "dragons" seems to coincide with the symbol of the Pilot. If MagicDuel were a Plane. Mur would be the Pilot. And everyone else would be the "passengers" or the "co-pilots" or a mixture of both. An interesting concept.

[center][IMG]http://harmon1.org/gifs/wings.gif[/IMG][/center]


The most interesting part of this symbol is probably the tiny little sphere at the top of the symbol, between the two "dragons". It is interesting because of what is in it, and where it is placed. It appears to be a figure 8. A figure 8 can mean anything from eternity.

For those of you who want to read something rather entertaining, please read this. It is about the number 8. I thought it was insightful into the personality of Mur. :D

[url="http://www.spiritual-numerology.com/numerology-number-meaning/numerology-meaning-of-number-8.html"]Number 8[/url]


I have many more theories about the meaning of each section but each is just as far fetched as these... LOL :D

I hope you enjoyed reading. :D

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It incorporates the secret ingredient/clue to the SotIS symbols challenge ..its actualy highly related to that. The ends of the MT lines end in 8 points, placed strategically to for a square and its middle points. The eight point that was supposed to be on top is replaced by the tiny circle you compared with an 8. Its not 8 but its all about 8. For whoever knows about seals and such, the placement of those line speaks for itself. Not only this one is highly difficult to "break or "seal" but with the snake/dragon heads around it and the missing point above, makes it brag about this particularity in a very arogant way.

The wings mean something else not flying, its a trait of a certain type of nobility, protective power, supremacy. The slight angle down and not perfectly horizontal is essential to the meaning i wanted. It takes out the "hope" part and gives the symbol more raw power.


[img]http://www.urbanlifestyle.ro/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/Rio-Jesus1.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/images/isis5.jpg[/img] (in general in Egypt the :attitude: of the wings was however different, i inteded a more masculine/warrior attitude, but wings still mean that noble supremacy.

same: [img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nu9IPI9bqyg/SoBL4ioTAQI/AAAAAAAAA2Y/JcHQbDl16zs/s1600/nazi+eagle.gif[/img]

Anyway.. some things could be better but hey its just a land, not a nazi coat of arms prepared to takeover the world :|..lol..
For its purpose is perfect.

Oh and the decorations in Tribunal land, the 3 stripes, fit perfectly with the 3 lines in the coat of arms. 3 is a deceiving number here because it stands out but as soon as you look better you notice its 5, then its 7 then its 8, then 8+1 . chained reaction

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Okay I'll go ahead and say this. I may be wrong but I'd like to see how [color="#FF0000"]Mur[/color] would react to my short but informational finds.

Firstly the M&T in the coat of arms represent a 8-point star which is very symbolic around the world and the 8-point star is the very symbol of "early astronomy, interconnectedness, and faith in the ultimate harmony of Creation."To be honest I didn't notice that the circle on top was part of the 8-point star and wondered why there's a point on the middle then I found this, “The octagon, with a ninth point in the center, is also central to the mystical symbology of Sufism. It is the seal or design which Ernest Scott says ‘reaches for the innermost secrets of man’. Meaning wholeness, power and perfection, this primary geometrical symbol is one which Sufis associate with Shambhala …”

With that in mind it's very clear to me that this symbol also symbolizes the Sotis because "An eight-point star enclosed within a circle was the symbol for the sun god." The members of the Sotis will be the "servants" of the sun god or rather the members will be components of the sun which [color="#FF0000"]Mur[/color] is still searching for to create his "Sun."

And this all that I can find. I wonder if I'm correct?

P.S.
Here's the link where I quoted my information from. -> [url="http://moroccandesign.com/eight-point-star"]Eight-Point Star[/url]

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I know the difference.
You interrupted the circle of Uroborus, just like with your 'Tomato' circle :))

Regarding finding the exact combination of M and T... Only similar thing I found was this: http://www.kandaceacademy.org/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/hwemudua.gif
It's called Hwemudua.
Symbolizes aim towards best quality.

Tho I am pretty sure that that T is phallocentric :D Naughty Mur! :D

I'll try to find the exact combination, tho...

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Wow !!! I just realized my Avatar is a counter symbol of Tribunal land logos.

[IMG]http://i693.photobucket.com/albums/vv291/kvsubash/Ravanakill.jpg[/IMG]

Well If u Decode my forum avatar this is what u will get :
Tipu Kidnaps a Girl And there Comes the hero the Wing man: "Iam the God cos' i got wings and i will stop Ur Rudeness"
Tipu : "Ho yeah eat This". Tipu cuts the wings of the wing man. And runs away with the girl

[IMG]http://i693.photobucket.com/albums/vv291/kvsubash/TipuKidnap.jpg[/IMG]

Tipu and the girl happily lived ever after.

Well If u notice carefully i got 9 heads symbolizing the cardinal and inter-cardinals points of a Transmutation Circle (Only a alchemy can understand what iam talking about). N,NE,E,SE,S,SW,W,NW,Z. (Z not the goat man hehe but represent the Zenith of the the body).
But the Tribunal Logo got 8 points, they missed the important 9th Point Ho yes the zenith. Simply to say they got no defense if attacked from Air. Tipu can Avoid a bird Pooping but a tribunal members can't. Perhaps it is done on purpose for a greater cause.

As far as the M&T goes : Its simple, Mur's M tries to brainwash innocent people but Tipu's T appears in front of M and saves the World.

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@Tipu Mur said there are 8+1 points, so it has a 9th point.

The wings and the circle represent the [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winged_sun"]winged sun[/url]. It represents Horus or Ra and divinity, royalty and power. The winged sun also symbolises the eternal soul. The snakes represent the [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uraeus"]Uraeus[/url] which often flank the disk and represent sovereignty, royalty, deity, and divine authority. Only rather than protect the sun disc they look like they would be fighting each other if they weren't tied together by their tails. Therefore it could possibly be seen as a symbol that prevents a divine war. An other reason the snakes are tied together is probably to prevent them from completely closing of the sun. They block away the mayor part of the center but there still is an opening on the top which allows you to enter, if only you dare to face the snakes.

[img]http://www.egyptartsite.com/images/wing.GIF[/img]
[size="1"]The winged sun

[/size]For some reason to me the bottom seems to be a lot better protected then the top, mostly because the MT symbol mainly points down. The top point looks to me like a seed, and symbolises the origin of the east.

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that is a good point there. Also notice the TB map, _east is up_. East is a symbol not a direction too much.
A very very interesting point of view is about the symbol being protected in the lower part more than the upper. For that alone you get access to the border research forum area, if you don't have it already please talk to chewett about it.

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It's neither exact nor religious, but since I keep trying to find where the symbol appears in the world and this seems to be the answer...even though I can't even find a picture that shows what I'm thinking...

 

http://www.haleypestcontrol.com/files/CELLAR%20SPIDER%20UPSIDE%20DOWN.jpg

 

Symbol is like a spider making its thread upward.

Edited by Ackshan Bemunah

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I am reminded of the scales as look upon the M balancing on the T- I am somehow also seeing the Egyptian Ankh as well as a compass pointing north. The design looks like it could be part of a Automobile company's logo a sports car with a manual transmission. 

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